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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:22 pm 
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GreekSteel wrote:
The HC has as much say in the draft process as does the GM...at the very least its 50/50. so Colbert/Cowher >>>>>>> Colbert/Tomlin...either way who cares, fire them both but Tomlin DESERVES to have his ass shown the door. And he DID INHERIT and WIN WITH Colbert/Cowhers players.


Offense Colbert/Tomlin >>>>>>>>>>>offense Colbert/Cowher. Reverse for D.

What’s the point here?

And, so long as you’re simply stating that Tomlin inherited players, indisputable. But if that is somehow a ding against Tomlin. 100% wrong.

We can judge Tomlin all we want post 2011. Deservedly so. But he excelled and did exactly what he was hired to do from ‘07 thru ‘11 with, yes, Cowher’s players.


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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:39 am 
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Cowher won a game or two with Noll's players, as well.


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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:02 am 
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Ice wrote:
Cowher won a game or two with Noll's players, as well.


But he brought Capers and Lebeau onboard with him in 1992....and Blitzburgh was born!

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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:23 pm 
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Are we back to the Cowher vs. Tomlin dumbass argument? Save yourself some fuckin' time. They are the same! They both won one Super Bowl (just barely), were/are great regular season coaches and not so much in the postseason. They are both more stubborn then 10 fuckin' mules. Cases in point - 2001 when Cowher refused to acknowledge there was anything wrong with Special Teams. Bit him in the ass in the end. Tomlin refuses to do anything about his time management dumbfuckedness. Most on this board lambasted Cowher (including me). Some of those still praise Tomlin. Hypocrites.

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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:18 pm 
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Obviously wrote:
Are we back to the Cowher vs. Tomlin dumbass argument? Save yourself some fuckin' time. They are the same! They both won one Super Bowl (just barely), were/are great regular season coaches and not so much in the postseason. They are both more stubborn then 10 fuckin' mules. Cases in point - 2001 when Cowher refused to acknowledge there was anything wrong with Special Teams. Bit him in the ass in the end. Tomlin refuses to do anything about his time management dumbfuckedness. Most on this board lambasted Cowher (including me). Some of those still praise Tomlin. Hypocrites.

This!

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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:30 pm 
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Obviously wrote:
Are we back to the Cowher vs. Tomlin dumbass argument? Save yourself some fuckin' time. They are the same! They both won one Super Bowl (just barely), were/are great regular season coaches and not so much in the postseason. They are both more stubborn then 10 fuckin' mules. Cases in point - 2001 when Cowher refused to acknowledge there was anything wrong with Special Teams. Bit him in the ass in the end. Tomlin refuses to do anything about his time management dumbfuckedness. Most on this board lambasted Cowher (including me). Some of those still praise Tomlin. Hypocrites.


For about three pages, several folks, maybe even yourself included, I honestly have stopped keeping track, have espoused the idea that Tomlin won with Cowher's players. Was only pointing out that (as is the nature of anything other than taking over an expansion franchise) Cowher also won with Noll's players early on in his career. Like every other coach who has ever taken over an existing franchise. Which renders the who won with whose players argument pretty much moot.


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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:52 pm 
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Ice wrote:
Like every other coach who has ever taken over an existing franchise. Which renders the who won with whose players argument pretty much moot.


But, again, Cowher brought Lebeau and Capers onboard, and those guys were instrumental to the success that followed. VERY DIFFERENT from inheriting a coaching staff, along with a HOF QB.

Also, while Cowher won with "Noll's guys", he continued to win and rebuilt that team at least 3 times. He went to an AFCC twice each with 3 different QB's, a feat that Tomlin will never match. In fact, Tomlin has had a HOF QB the whole time and has only made it to 3 AFCC's, total.

Yeah, we shouldn't compare Tomlin to Cowher because aside from regular season wins he's really not in the same ballpark.

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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:13 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
Ice wrote:
Like every other coach who has ever taken over an existing franchise. Which renders the who won with whose players argument pretty much moot.


But, again, Cowher brought Lebeau and Capers onboard, and those guys were instrumental to the success that followed. VERY DIFFERENT from inheriting a coaching staff, along with a HOF QB.

Also, while Cowher won with "Noll's guys", he continued to win and rebuilt that team at least 3 times. He went to an AFCC twice each with 3 different QB's, a feat that Tomlin will never match. In fact, Tomlin has had a HOF QB the whole time and has only made it to 3 AFCC's, total.

Yeah, we shouldn't compare Tomlin to Cowher because aside from regular season wins he's really not in the same ballpark.


If given the choice I'd take Cowher.

That's honestly very scary to admit


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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:24 pm 
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If you get rid of Tomlin, the next guy will have to win with his guys, too.


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 Post subject: Re: Mark Madden on Steelers Clubhouse
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:04 pm 
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Ice wrote:
If you get rid of Tomlin, the next guy will win with his guys, too.


Fixed

I’d rather have “the next guy” try cause the dope we have isn’t winning anything.

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