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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:07 am 
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Stillerz Bar wrote:
Good Lord - the right answer of course is

"We're trying to win a Super Bowl and I have an important playoff game to focus on. There will be plenty of time to deal with my contract once the season is over."

Then he can bitch and moan all he wants about how $14M isn't enough.

Seriously, how much of this year's drama is self inflicted? :roll:

Thanks- this is the story....that’s he is a dipshit when he opens his mouth which has been a story with many pages with this team. Hopefully they back up all the drama with dominating performances in the next 3 games.


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:15 am 
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BethlehemSteel wrote:
Bell said before practice that he would sit out again or retire next year if they tag me :roll:

He better take care of fucking business

http://www.wjbdradio.com/national-sport ... -him-again

Quote:
One of the National Football League's biggest stars says he would consider sitting out a full season, or even retiring, if his team tries to use the league's franchise tag on him for the second straight year.

Pittsburgh Steelers running back Le'Veon Bell made the comments to ESPN, saying that he is optimistic that he won't be forced to make such a decision. "But I would definitely consider it," he said, before Thursday's practice.

Bell played under the franchise tag this season, earning $12.1 million. That number is expected to increase to about $14.5 million next year.

The Steelers can tag a player between February 20 and March 6, with the two sides having until July 16 to agree to a long-term contract.

Bell says he just wants the team to "value me." That after turning down a long-term deal worth up to $30 million for the first two years last offseason.

"Just get the numbers straight exactly where we want them. I'm not going to settle for anything," Bell said. "I know what I do and what I bring to the table. I'm not going out here getting the ball 400 times if I'm not getting what I feel I'm valued at."

Bell caught 85 passes for 655 yards and rushed 321 times for 1,291 yards and scored 11 total touchdowns this season. If he did decide to sit out, Bell acknowledged that his career would likely be over.

"I'm happy where I'm at," he said. "Football is kind of like my job, it's not something that makes me unhappy, but I don't need it to be happy. I've made the money that I feel I needed to make, my family would be good. I don't necessarily care if I get more money or not."


Hey Ding Bat.
You are one of 53 that needs to stay focused and play as a team on Sunday.
Can think about dollar signs after winning the SB.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:16 am 
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R S wrote:
Bell is dumb. Players in general are dumb. If we all just accept that notion, and watch the game for what it is, we would all be less agitated in general.


Winner!

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:16 am 
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22 minutes later.......Tap, tap on shoulder....or text message to Bell

"Hey Ding Bat.
You are one of 53 that needs to stay focused and play as a team on Sunday.
Can think about dollar signs after winning the SB"

Oh right....OK


JackSplat58 wrote:
Quote:
Le'Veon Bell
‏Verified account @L_Bell26
12h12 hours ago

I’m trying to win a super bowl...I can care less about what happens after this season...my biggest thing I’m focused on is this team I’m on right now, playing for/with my brothers, & bringing back a 7th ring! what happens next year is irrelevant to my goals

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:21 am 
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If Ben is back, which I think he will be.
You certainly bring Bell back.
If a deal can not be worked out.,
You franchise him.
And go win a second straight SB.

He holds out.
Can not see him leaving $14.5 on the table.
That's $14.5 he is never going to make back, even if someone signs him to a ridiculous contract as an UFA in 2019.

We get a fresh Lev Bell right about the time the PS start playing good football.
Fresh for the second half of season and another run at the SB

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:22 am 
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Stosh-67 wrote:
22 minutes later.......Tap, tap on shoulder....or text message to Bell

"Hey Ding Bat.
You are one of 53 that needs to stay focused and play as a team on Sunday.
Can think about dollar signs after winning the SB"

Oh right....OK


JackSplat58 wrote:
Quote:
Le'Veon Bell
‏Verified account @L_Bell26
12h12 hours ago

I’m trying to win a super bowl...I can care less about what happens after this season...my biggest thing I’m focused on is this team I’m on right now, playing for/with my brothers, & bringing back a 7th ring! what happens next year is irrelevant to my goals


These guys just have no filter. I do not think Bell's comments mean that he is not absolutely hyper-focused on helping the team reach and win a SB.

But let's face it. The NFL requires players to be available for media. Unfortunately, Bell is unable to keep his trap shut when asked a question about next year. But I doubt this becomes a locker room distraction.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:49 am 
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Sign and trade him for stud LBer

Draft his replacement

Fuck him

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:18 am 
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BarryFoster wrote:
Sign and trade him for stud LBer

Draft his replacement

Fuck him


Overreaction Friday?


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:23 am 
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Stosh-67 wrote:
If Ben is back, which I think he will be.
You certainly bring Bell back.
If a deal can not be worked out.,
You franchise him.
And go win a second straight SB.

He holds out.
Can not see him leaving $14.5 on the table.
That's $14.5 he is never going to make back, even if someone signs him to a ridiculous contract as an UFA in 2019.

We get a fresh Lev Bell right about the time the PS start playing good football.
Fresh for the second half of season and another run at the SB

I can live with this! Hate to let the guy walk after next year but it’s looking more and more like we aren’t going to be able to sign him - I can’t see Art2 franchising him then trading.


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:25 am 
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fortythree wrote:
Hilarious overreaction in this thread.

Yes - just side splitting :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:34 am 
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Kodiak wrote:
Also, if Bell is tagged this year (for the 2nd time) it's 20% more, for a total of @ $14.5M

Non-QB's cannot be tagged for a 3rd year. He's guaranteed to be a UFA after next year if he doesn't sign an extension.


Kodiak where is your source on this statement? I have read nothing to this effect. There is actually arguments about using it a fourth time on Cousins. I have seen no language about the tag having a position segmentation. The tag is tag and the QB comes into play in the language often only because they on the whole have the biggest contract.

Per Reddit source :) :

First year franchise tag:

120% of the previous year's salary, or average of the top 5 salaries of everyone else playing that position, whichever is higher. The "average" is actually a percentage of the cap. It's calculated as follows: Take the franchise tag amounts for the position for each of the previous 5 years, add them all up. Divide them by the sum of the salary cap totals for each of the previous 5 years. Multiply that by the salary cap for this year. So if the five previous franchise amounts were $10M, $11M, $12M, $13M, $14M and the salary caps were $100M, $105M, $110M, $120M, $130M, and this year's salary cap is $140M, it'd be (10+11+12+13+14)/(100+105+110+120+130) = 10.69% of $140M, or $14.86M.
Second year of the franchise tag:

Same thing. Unless the math gets really weird, the 120% increase is likely to be the higher amount.
Third year of the franchise tag:

An average of the top 5 salaries at the highest paid position (likely QB). So if a WR's tag amount is $12M, but a QB's tag amount is $20M, a WR tagged a 3rd time will get the $20M. OR 120% of the average of the 5 largest prior year salaries at his position (so 120% of the 5 biggest WR contracts from the year before, in this case). OR 144% of the player's previous year's salary. Whichever is highest.
There's nothing in the CBA saying they can't be tagged a 4th time. I would assume a 4th year would have the same rules as a 3rd, which means the cost at that point would be pretty outrageous.

Also, of minor note: The player can choose to take the 120/144% increase over the average of the salaries if he wants, even if the 120/144% increase is the lower amount. Why he would take less money I don't know, but it's an option for him. The team is required to offer the higher of the two, but the player can opt to take the lower amount.



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IMHO......no way in hell he sits out a season!


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:56 am 
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They'll work it out, this is a non-issue.


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:06 pm 
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Only because it is a great portion/clause of the CBA that put players and owners over the barrel. If we had the baseball free agency model, Bell would be in the Big Apple.


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:53 pm 
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LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Kodiak where is your source on this statement?


LMAO
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... chise-tag/

That's the first article in the google search. The next one:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... tag-limit/


LOL, I guess there's no limit to the number of tags. But the Steelers will never tag Bell a 3rd time for $20M.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:36 pm 
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Not an easy topic to Google and get a difinitive answer. That means the lawyers have done there job with CBA for both sides I guess.

As you said, no chance in hell they will tag him a 3rd time, and no chance in hell he sits!

Both sides have leverage and it should be a perfect year for a long term deal.

Why do you need an agent if you are Bell in 2018? I’d fire my agent today, take the tag, get a 20% raise plus an additional agent free bonus of 6-10% I would guess, and then rehire an agent in 2019 when the real work will be done. Either do the LT contract or fire your agent.


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:25 pm 
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LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Not an easy topic to Google and get a difinitive answer. That means the lawyers have done there job with CBA for both sides I guess.

As you said, no chance in hell they will tag him a 3rd time, and no chance in hell he sits!

Both sides have leverage and it should be a perfect year for a long term deal.

Why do you need an agent if you are Bell in 2018? I’d fire my agent today, take the tag, get a 20% raise plus an additional agent free bonus of 6-10% I would guess, and then rehire an agent in 2019 when the real work will be done. Either do the LT contract or fire your agent.


My guess is that if the Steelers tag him, Bell will ask permission to seek a trade. That's where an agent comes into play. However, if Bell is content to play another season under the tag. He should take some of the agent fee and apply it to injury insurance and pocket the rest. Then, try to get a 25m guaranteed once he hits FA + 10m in first two years.


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:07 pm 
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LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Not an easy topic to Google and get a difinitive answer. That means the lawyers have done there job with CBA for both sides I guess.


I thought I've read multiple places about the 2 and 3 tag deal. But that second PFW article seemed pretty definitive that there's no such explicit language in the CBA.

As the articles mentioned, it's hard to imagine anyone getting a 4th tag (or a 3rd on a non-QB). And would such a player REALLY be upset about 2.5X the franchise tag?


I can't know how I'd react or think in Bell's situation, but IMO most players have a very irrational fear of a career-ending injury (yeah, I know, Shazier). It's something so rare that you could and should get relatively cheap insurance for it. Otherwise, tag me 2 or 3 times and then I'm a FA and I'm laughing all the way to the bank. Every star should go that route. But if you start talking extension a year or two earlier, then that changes the calculus quite a bit.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:08 pm 
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Zeke5123 wrote:
If he doesn’t care about money, why would he sit out over money? Also, BS someone would turn down a 14m payday when they care bout money; that’s crazy. Threating to sit out is only leverage.

no lie..oh no; they made me play for 14+ mill...im so mad... :lol:
that's 14 million u can never get back..another year in your prime u cant replay.. no way he passes on that..im not sure what bells value is..lets win the bowl and then see..


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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:46 pm 
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Sorry, but I am able to take off the homer glasses with Bell and say that his receiving prowess are over-rated.

The offense this year did not take off because we were throwing to Bell more all of a sudden. No, the offense took off because of the ascension of one JuJu Smith-Schuster. You take him out of this offense and I don't know what you would have had this season, it would have been a train wreck.

Bell's 7.7 yards per carry is actually pretty dismal when you compare it to the other top RBs that catch the ball. He also does not help move the chains as much as some of you may think.

106 targets, 31 first downs. That is a 29% first down rate on targets. David Johnson last season for Arizona had a 35% first down rate on his targets, Alvin Kamara this season, as a rookie, had a 38% first down rate on his targets in the passing game. But those two RBs averaged over 10 yards a catch, have the breakaway speed to score more TDs, are more dangerous as receivers. Bell claims to be this great catcher as a RB, like a 2nd WR out there but he is flat out wrong.

As I said, if you are a defense you want the Steelers to target Bell more in the passing game and give less targets to somebody like JuJu.

I mean JuJu, he was targeted 79 times and produced 39 first downs, that 49% first down rate on targets was better than Antonio Brown's 43% rate.

Bell could have 10 catches for 80 yards in a game but it is amazing to me the additional yards and first downs that don't happen because of his lack of speed. I see a nice 8 yard catch that might have been 25 yards with Kamara or Johnson, I see a very good 25 yard catch and run by Bell that might have been a 50 yard TD catch and run by Kamara and Johnson.

If JuJu does not have a big game against Jax I think we lose this game, regardless of what Bell or Brown do.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:53 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
Sorry, but I am able to take off the homer glasses with Bell and say that his receiving prowess are over-rated.

The offense this year did not take off because we were throwing to Bell more all of a sudden. No, the offense took off because of the ascension of one JuJu Smith-Schuster. You take him out of this offense and I don't know what you would have had this season, it would have been a train wreck.

Bell's 7.7 yards per carry is actually pretty dismal when you compare it to the other top RBs that catch the ball. He also does not help move the chains as much as some of you may think.

106 targets, 31 first downs. That is a 29% first down rate on targets. David Johnson last season for Arizona had a 35% first down rate on his targets, Alvin Kamara this season, as a rookie, had a 38% first down rate on his targets in the passing game. But those two RBs averaged over 10 yards a catch, have the breakaway speed to score more TDs, are more dangerous as receivers. Bell claims to be this great catcher as a RB, like a 2nd WR out there but he is flat out wrong.

As I said, if you are a defense you want the Steelers to target Bell more in the passing game and give less targets to somebody like JuJu.

I mean JuJu, he was targeted 79 times and produced 39 first downs, that 49% first down rate on targets was better than Antonio Brown's 43% rate.

Bell could have 10 catches for 80 yards in a game but it is amazing to me the additional yards and first downs that don't happen because of his lack of speed. I see a nice 8 yard catch that might have been 25 yards with Kamara or Johnson, I see a very good 25 yard catch and run by Bell that might have been a 50 yard TD catch and run by Kamara and Johnson.

If JuJu does not have a big game against Jax I think we lose this game, regardless of what Bell or Brown do.




You're not totally wrong on Bell, hes a great back but you are correct in that he leaves yards on the field withnhis lack of that extra gear, he does though create yards where there appear to be none on many occasions. As far as your call Scunge that we need a big game from JuJu to win, i agree. in fact i called big games out Juju AND MacDonald, i think both those guys are gonna be huge for us as well as a big deal from Bell as far as total yards from scrimmage.


Last edited by GreekSteel on Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:57 pm 
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I was one of the biggest Bell fans and defenders before the season, and in that early stretch while he was working himself back.

I saw flashes of power and explosiveness, but that was it. Nothing like prior seasons. His productivity was purely a function of how often he got the ball.....because his YPC rushing and receiving were pretty average.

While it's fun to entertain the idea of drafting Bell's replacement and spending that money on a stud defensive FA, the reality is elite guys rarely hit the market any more. Usually what you end-up with is a highly overpaid guy who's old team knew was already declining.

Add to that they won't be giving a huge contract to Shazier and it's a lead-pipe lock that Bell is tagged again. I would love to sign him for, say 4/$40M, but that would insult him. And he's made it clear he's not signing the deal he was offered last year. But if he's not better next year, not taking that deal might save the Steelers from themselves.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:00 pm 
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It is interesting, however, that since Bell made it clear he wants redonkulous money that PIT maybe decided "fine, run the wheels for 2 years and say sionara"......and now maybe Bell figured that out so he's bitching about 400 touches and getting tagged

This may not be the non-issue/slamdunk we're thinking. Bell could very well choose to sit out 6-8 games and still get a very nice check. And then we saw this year it could take him 3-4 weeks to work his way back to speed.

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 Post subject: Re: Latest Drama Angle - Bell @ next year
PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:09 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
It is interesting, however, that since Bell made it clear he wants redonkulous money that PIT maybe decided "fine, run the wheels for 2 years and say sionara"......and now maybe Bell figured that out so he's bitching about 400 touches and getting tagged

This may not be the non-issue/slamdunk we're thinking. Bell could very well choose to sit out 6-8 games and still get a very nice check. And then we saw this year it could take him 3-4 weeks to work his way back to speed.




I agree with you in that respect, id tag him and run the wheels off for 1 more season, if he wants to sit out or retire, id call his bluff. Hell, maybe someone would want to sign and trade for him and get us another premium pick.


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