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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:04 pm 
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TB wrote:
0% chance we or any other team takes Jordan Willis in the first round.

Avatar bet? I think he goes no later than Atlanta at 31.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:06 pm 
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TB wrote:
I don't think the Steelers see Willis as an OLB, looks like a DL/play with your hand on the ground player only. Lotta likable traits, but can he bend and flatten on the edge? Play in space? I don't think the Steelers think so.

He literally fits all of the benchmarks (size, testing) set by looking at a decade of OLB picks they've made. Their lack of interest is astounding.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:16 pm 
I see the book on Willis as this

Elite football character......gives you everything he has on the field and off
Elite physical measureables........as good any OLB drafted in the top 10

Lacks a plethora of techniques at this point.....isnt polished as it were.....thats coaching.....which I think we have.....and want to on his part....which hes demostrated at every turn so far.....

His floor imo is an Aaron Smith Joey Porter type player......always solid at times great.....the Steelers need those players right now


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:19 pm 
bradshaw2ben wrote:
TB wrote:
I don't think the Steelers see Willis as an OLB, looks like a DL/play with your hand on the ground player only. Lotta likable traits, but can he bend and flatten on the edge? Play in space? I don't think the Steelers think so.

He literally fits all of the benchmarks (size, testing) set by looking at a decade of OLB picks they've made. Their lack of interest is astounding.


I hope its a smokescreen.....imo hes far and away the best 1st pick that has a shot at being there


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:47 pm 
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SteelerChef wrote:
Martavis is the most talented WR in the NFL since Randy Moss. Legit HOF talent.
Wha? He has proven jack shit. He has the potential to be great, but is far from that right now. Not even close to Randy Moss and his HOF status is not fait accompli by any stretch.

Scunge wrote:
The one thing about Bryant coming back from suspension and realizing his potential is that it is really, really so against the odds. I mean the odds are so ridiculous that the Steelers should spend a high pick on a WR in this draft.

I have looked over the list of suspended players the past 10 years and it is grim. Show me a player who was suspended for 10 games, suspended for an entire season and then had a come to Jesus moment, cleaned up his act and then emerged as a great player. All I see are players that continue the downward spiral, continue to get suspended, get suspended indefinitely, move from team to team, and never live up to their potential.

My outlook on Bryant is that I don't expect anything from him and if he does get reinstated, if he does play well, then great, but it does not stop me from taking a WR high in this year's draft, first or second round.
This. Although unlike everybody else, I haven't given up entirely on Coates being a valuable contributor.

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Last edited by COR-TEN on Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:25 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
TB wrote:
I don't think the Steelers see Willis as an OLB, looks like a DL/play with your hand on the ground player only. Lotta likable traits, but can he bend and flatten on the edge? Play in space? I don't think the Steelers think so.

He literally fits all of the benchmarks (size, testing) set by looking at a decade of OLB picks they've made. Their lack of interest is astounding.


I don't think it's astounding, they just don't see him as a OLB in their system IMO. Do you want him out in the flat trying to D up Dion Lewis? Can he drop 30% of the time? To me, he looks like a guy who can't bend and has to take extra steps when trying to run the edge. Like I said, there's a lot to like, but I don't see the fit. I don't think the Steelers do either.

As for the bet, sure. I've got no shame. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:16 pm 
TB wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
TB wrote:
I don't think the Steelers see Willis as an OLB, looks like a DL/play with your hand on the ground player only. Lotta likable traits, but can he bend and flatten on the edge? Play in space? I don't think the Steelers think so.

He literally fits all of the benchmarks (size, testing) set by looking at a decade of OLB picks they've made. Their lack of interest is astounding.


I don't think it's astounding, they just don't see him as a OLB in their system IMO. Do you want him out in the flat trying to D up Dion Lewis? Can he drop 30% of the time? To me, he looks like a guy who can't bend and has to take extra steps when trying to run the edge. Like I said, there's a lot to like, but I don't see the fit. I don't think the Steelers do either.

As for the bet, sure. I've got no shame. :D



Lol.....without looking tell me which of these combine results is Lewis ?

I will fill you in on the other 3 later 8-)





40 YARD DASH: 4.53 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 24 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 39.0 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 125.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 6.85 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.28 SEC


40 YARD DASH: 4.57 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 17 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 34.5 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 112.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 6.90 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.18 SEC



40 YARD DASH: 4.64 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 33 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 41.0 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 128.0 INCH


40 YARD DASH: 4.65 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 23 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 40.0 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 128.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 7.08 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.18 SEC


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:26 pm 
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If Willis played to his combine numbers we wouldn't even be having any argument. He'd be a top 20 lock. But he doesn't.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:33 pm 
TB wrote:
If Willis played to his combine numbers we wouldn't even be having any argument. He'd be a top 20 lock. But he doesn't.



:lol: :shock:

Again.....to me that says he needs polishing....coaching...

Is it that hard to imagine that a guy with those measureables hasnt needed or recieved the very best training so far in his career ?

The guy lives for football and his team and has HOF elite tools to work with. Whats not to like at 30 ?


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:37 pm 
TB wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
TB wrote:
I don't think the Steelers see Willis as an OLB, looks like a DL/play with your hand on the ground player only. Lotta likable traits, but can he bend and flatten on the edge? Play in space? I don't think the Steelers think so.

He literally fits all of the benchmarks (size, testing) set by looking at a decade of OLB picks they've made. Their lack of interest is astounding.


I don't think it's astounding, they just don't see him as a OLB in their system IMO. Do you want him out in the flat trying to D up Dion Lewis? Can he drop 30% of the time? To me, he looks like a guy who can't bend and has to take extra steps when trying to run the edge. Like I said, there's a lot to like, but I don't see the fit. I don't think the Steelers do either.

As for the bet, sure. I've got no shame. :D




Oh....and for those following along....heres the names



Jordan Willis
40 YARD DASH: 4.53 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 24 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 39.0 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 125.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 6.85 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.28 SEC

All World Dion Lewis
40 YARD DASH: 4.57 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 17 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 34.5 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 112.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 6.90 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.18 SEC


Myles Garrett
40 YARD DASH: 4.64 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 33 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 41.0 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 128.0 INCH

Khalil Mack
40 YARD DASH: 4.65 SEC
BENCH PRESS: 23 REPS
VERTICAL JUMP: 40.0 INCH
BROAD JUMP: 128.0 INCH
3 CONE DRILL: 7.08 SEC
20 YARD SHUTTLE: 4.18 SEC


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:47 pm 
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If a guy has his measurables and his level of production, why would we even be debating this? Why would you be mocking him as a second round pick to us? How in the world could he even drop to 30?

The guy is stiff on film and doesn't play to those measurables. He can't bend or flatten on the edge, and he doesn't look like a guy who can play off the LOS. The Steelers aren't even sniffing him and they aren't just doing it as a smokescreen, something our crew just doesn't do. But I guess I'm the one who's nuts here for even suggesting he's a second day player.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 4:40 pm 
TB wrote:
If a guy has his measurables and his level of production, why would we even be debating this? Why would you be mocking him as a second round pick to us? How in the world could he even drop to 30?

The guy is stiff on film and doesn't play to those measurables. He can't bend or flatten on the edge, and he doesn't look like a guy who can play off the LOS. The Steelers aren't even sniffing him and they aren't just doing it as a smokescreen, something our crew just doesn't do. But I guess I'm the one who's nuts here for even suggesting he's a second day player.


There is a real difference between CANT bend or set an edge and HASNT NEEDED TO....

Quote:


Still, consistency was not a problem for the Big XII’s leading sack man in 2016. He racked up 11.5 sacks and totaled 17.5 tackles for loss, one year after he finished with 8.5 and 14.5 respectively as a Junior. He also forced three fumbles in each of those two seasons.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:33 pm 
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It is really wishful thinking that JuJu will last to the end of the 3rd round. I have 5 WRs all going in the first 50 picks.

My top 5 WRs as this:
Corey Davis, Mike Williams, John Ross, JuJu, Zay Jones. I think that they will all be off the board in 50 picks and that the first 3 will go in the first round and JuJu and Jones going early to mid round 2. Then on the border of that group is Godwin and I think that he probably is picked at the end of round 2, probably before we pick.

Sure, everybody talks a big game about how deep this draft is, how we can get a WR in round 3 or later to help out, well screw that, I want, this team NEEDS a WR who can come in immediately and play and have an impact as the starting #2 or #3 WR. Once you get past those first 5 WRs you are looking at guys that will have to develop, to learn how to play, run routes, get acclimated to the NFL.

Bryant with his reinstatement, Coates with his hand and confidence, no Markus Wheaton, Heyward-Bey dealing with his first serious injury last year, is that the beginning of his body breaking down? Eli Rogers was just okay in his first year as the slot WR. I know Ben loves his guys and called Rogers one of his best slot WRs but the proof is in the pudding. Rogers just does not have the speed and quickness to do major damage as the slot. He does not break tackles, he does not get much yardage after the catch. He is limited, we need to do better. Those are a lot of question marks and gambles on important, crucial pieces of the offense. The #2 and #3 WRs failed us last year and going into this year we are going to gamble on them again?

Here we are talking about picking a CB, how a slot CB is a need and people have no problem spending a 1st and 2nd round pick on that slot CB if needed. But we have Golson who was a 2nd round pick. I have more confidence in Golson finally becoming a player this year than I do in last year's WR group stepping up.

In terms of Willis and where he will go, I kinda agree with TB. I have seen a lot of mocks where Willis does not sniff the first round. I have also see a lot of mocks of late that are putting Josh Jones the safety in the first round. It is kind of nuts right now, players are all over the map in terms of where they will be taken. I don't think Willis is raw at all, or needs to be coached up, to me he is really sort of maxed out right now. He is advanced in how he plays the run, sheds blocks, sets the edge. As a pass rusher he looks pretty good to me as well but for as talented as he is athletically, it all just does not add up. He is the not the sum of all the great parts, the size, the athlete, the hustle, the motor. I was expecting more great play out of him, more dominance and was just found disappointed. But that is not really to surprising as I have come to think of this entire edge rusher draft class as underwhelming. To me there are two players worthy of being drafted in round 1 (and both will be gone in the first 5 picks or so) and then the rest I would only touch starting with my second rounder.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2017 9:38 pm 
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There will be WRs undrafted in this this draft class better on day 1 than 2nd half Coates, Eli Rogers, Demarcus Ayers, and Cobi Hamilton. It's stupid deep.

More importantly, you're going to have a hard time making an argument that the difference in grade on the 5th WR taken and the 20th are going to be all that different, especially if you are looking for a solid #2 with some nice traits (or a nice number 4/5 if Bryant returns).

I'm inclined to draft a RB, WR, QB or TE--- all on Day 3. Draft 3 of the 4 pf Saturday. A 1st/2nd round pick at offensive skill positions for this team is a glorious waste, unless Patrick Mahomes, David Njoku, Corey Davis, or O.J. Howard fall to 1.30.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:25 pm 
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Love me some U

Would be crazy to go TE in the first, but Njoku would look real nice in black and gold.

Plus his first name is very normal and he has a nice frame w decent wrist circumference.

I'm in

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:41 pm 
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BarryFoster wrote:
Love me some U

Would be crazy to go TE in the first, but Njoku would look real nice in black and gold.

Plus his first name is very normal and he has a nice frame w decent wrist circumference.

I'm in


What about Mahomes?

If his dick is grey, you have to draft him on the first day.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:45 pm 
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Still Lit wrote:
BarryFoster wrote:
Love me some U

Would be crazy to go TE in the first, but Njoku would look real nice in black and gold.

Plus his first name is very normal and he has a nice frame w decent wrist circumference.

I'm in


What about Mahomes?

If his dick is grey, you have to draft him on the first day.


Do they detail penis coloring in some sort of comprehensive draft guide?

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:18 pm 
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BarryFoster wrote:
Still Lit wrote:
BarryFoster wrote:
Love me some U

Would be crazy to go TE in the first, but Njoku would look real nice in black and gold.

Plus his first name is very normal and he has a nice frame w decent wrist circumference.

I'm in


What about Mahomes?

If his dick is grey, you have to draft him on the first day.


Do they detail penis coloring in some sort of comprehensive draft guide?


Right there along with frame size and wrist circumference.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:53 am 
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Quote:
“We have not gotten word on Martavis Bryant,” said Steelers general manager Kevin Colbert. “We have no information. We have no idea if we’ll get information (before the draft) or not. We have to operate under the assumption that, until he is here, he is not here.” http://www.observer-reporter.com/201704 ... _on_bryant


As we all feared. Nothing yet about Bryant. Likely, after the draft sometime?


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:35 am 
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Well, my greatest fear is that we don't draft a WR high, then the Commish takes his sweet old time and reinstates Bryant right before the season starts, in which time he has not been able to go through training camp or play in any preseason games.

Think about that for a second, what if the Commish takes too long to reinstate Bryant and he isn't able to shake the rust off with a proper training camp and preseason?
As Colbert said, they are not allowed to have any contact with him, he is not able to practice with the team, etc. Does anybody really think that Bryant will just magically step on the field and be the same player? And will he be able to go long before getting injured in that scenario?

This is why I have been preaching taking a WR high, first or second round. If Davis is there at the end of round 1 you take him, or if Godwin or Zay Jones or JuJu is there at the end of round 2, you take one of them. Just too much of a gamble to place a bet on Bryant being reinstated in a timely fashion, that Coates mangled hand will be fine, or that Green will get over his concussions. We need another playmaker, another stud to round out the trio of Bell and Brown and (fill in the blank). WR or TE needs to happen in round 1 or 2. Crucial for 2017 and beyond. A First round WR or TE and that 5th year option means that player would complete the new 'Triplets' and they would play together for 4-5 years. That is huge.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:16 am 
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Scunge wrote:
Well, my greatest fear is that we don't draft a WR high, then the Commish takes his sweet old time and reinstates Bryant right before the season starts, in which time he has not been able to go through training camp or play in any preseason games.

Think about that for a second, what if the Commish takes too long to reinstate Bryant and he isn't able to shake the rust off with a proper training camp and preseason?
As Colbert said, they are not allowed to have any contact with him, he is not able to practice with the team, etc. Does anybody really think that Bryant will just magically step on the field and be the same player? And will he be able to go long before getting injured in that scenario?

This is why I have been preaching taking a WR high, first or second round. If Davis is there at the end of round 1 you take him, or if Godwin or Zay Jones or JuJu is there at the end of round 2, you take one of them. Just too much of a gamble to place a bet on Bryant being reinstated in a timely fashion, that Coates mangled hand will be fine, or that Green will get over his concussions. We need another playmaker, another stud to round out the trio of Bell and Brown and (Ben). WR or TE needs to happen in round 1 or 2. Crucial for 2017 and beyond. A First round WR or TE and that 5th year option means that player would complete the new 'Triplets' and they would play together for 4-5 years. That is huge.



Scunge, I took the liberty of filling out the blank with the other stud.

I also agree, one more WR or TE early in the draft could be a need because of the Bryant gamble.


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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:41 am 
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BarryFoster wrote:
Still Lit wrote:
BarryFoster wrote:
Love me some U

Would be crazy to go TE in the first, but Njoku would look real nice in black and gold.

Plus his first name is very normal and he has a nice frame w decent wrist circumference.

I'm in


What about Mahomes?

If his dick is grey, you have to draft him on the first day.


Do they detail penis coloring in some sort of comprehensive draft guide?


If not, they should start.

I think SteelerFurt has come up with a fool proof drafting system:

1.) Is his name normal?
2.) What's his frame like?
3.) What is his wrist circumference
4.) What color is his dick?

If they pass those tests, then you can start looking at things like 40 time, strength, closing ability, catching ability, durability, etc. etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 10:00 am 
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Scunge wrote:
Well, my greatest fear is that we don't draft a WR high, then the Commish takes his sweet old time and reinstates Bryant right before the season starts, in which time he has not been able to go through training camp or play in any preseason games.

Think about that for a second, what if the Commish takes too long to reinstate Bryant and he isn't able to shake the rust off with a proper training camp and preseason?
As Colbert said, they are not allowed to have any contact with him, he is not able to practice with the team, etc. Does anybody really think that Bryant will just magically step on the field and be the same player? And will he be able to go long before getting injured in that scenario?

This is why I have been preaching taking a WR high, first or second round. If Davis is there at the end of round 1 you take him, or if Godwin or Zay Jones or JuJu is there at the end of round 2, you take one of them. Just too much of a gamble to place a bet on Bryant being reinstated in a timely fashion, that Coates mangled hand will be fine, or that Green will get over his concussions. We need another playmaker, another stud to round out the trio of Bell and Brown and (fill in the blank). WR or TE needs to happen in round 1 or 2. Crucial for 2017 and beyond. A First round WR or TE and that 5th year option means that player would complete the new 'Triplets' and they would play together for 4-5 years. That is huge.

I agree with the bolded, if for no other reason than insurance...

Also, for Bryant's sake as well as the Steelers', this needs to be a question of "how bad do you want it, Martavis?!"
If this scenario goes down like many of us fear and drags through the offseason, he will need to make up on his own what he misses in team workouts.

He needs to man up and prove to himself above all that he can do it...
...perhaps as the only means of slaying the demons that have held him down.

I think it's the only way we get the absolute best Martavis Bryant on the field, and frankly I'm not sure I want him otherwise...

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:49 pm 
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What about Mahomes?

If his dick is grey, you have to draft him on the first day.[/quote]

Do they detail penis coloring in some sort of comprehensive draft guide?[/quote]

If not, they should start.

I think SteelerFurt has come up with a fool proof drafting system:

1.) Is his name normal?
2.) What's his frame like?
3.) What is his wrist circumference
4.) What color is his dick?

If they pass those tests, then you can start looking at things like 40 time, strength, closing ability, catching ability, durability, etc. etc.[/quote]

I like it. We should have someone take our recommendations to Heinz and hand deliver them to Colbert.

Of course there are names and frames that should have been DND, but have worked out nicely.

Examples:

Shazier overcame his frame

Martavis is an odd name, but when eligible to ply he is nasty.

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 Post subject: Re: Martavis Bryant
PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 4:08 pm 
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Conditionally reinstated...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/04/25/martavis-bryant-conditionally-reinstated-after-drug-suspension/

Quote:
Bryant can participate in team meetings and offseason workouts effective immediately. He will be allowed to participate in training camp practices and preseason games provided that he demonstrates before camp that he has made arrangements to continue drug treatment in Pittsburgh.

Before the regular season the NFL will review his progress, and if he has complied with drug treatment he will be fully reinstated for Week One.

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