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 Post subject: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:46 am 
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Man, that's a lot of coin and term for Jeff Skinner.

Think about the value we got on Guentzel.

Also, if 9 million for 8 years gets you Jeff Skinner in FA, Kessel, on that contract, becomes a much more valuable asset.


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2019 10:52 am 
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Anyone else laugh their ass off at the site of Cam Neely throwing his water bottle??? :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2019 2:46 pm 
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swissvale72 wrote:
Anyone else laugh their ass off at the site of Cam Neely throwing his water bottle??? :lol: :lol: :lol:



In a thread titled “Pens/NHL Off-season”, you managed to post something that had nothing to with neither the Pens nor the NHL Offseason and you did it with a thread that actually did pertain to your post only 4 lines down.

That’s some impressive work!


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2019 4:30 am 
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Louis Lipps Service wrote:
swissvale72 wrote:
Anyone else laugh their ass off at the site of Cam Neely throwing his water bottle??? :lol: :lol: :lol:



In a thread titled “Pens/NHL Off-season”, you managed to post something that had nothing to with neither the Pens nor the NHL Offseason and you did it with a thread that actually did pertain to your post only 4 lines down.

That’s some impressive work!

So scaredy-cat lipps, the websites premier coward, now functions as yet another hall monitor. Maybe you can convince one of your mod friends to move the post.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:47 am 
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35 years ago on this day, the Penguins drafted Mario Lemieux. Things have worked out fairly well since then.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2019 2:45 pm 
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fractalsteel wrote:
35 years ago on this day, the Penguins drafted Mario Lemieux. Things have worked out fairly well since then.
Fuck I'm old.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2019 6:46 pm 
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COR-TEN wrote:
fractalsteel wrote:
35 years ago on this day, the Penguins drafted Mario Lemieux. Things have worked out fairly well since then.
Fuck I'm old.


I turn 36 this summer. Been a heck of a life to be a Pens fan.


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:59 am 
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Any draft insights, assuming the pick stays at 18 as it currently stands?


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:03 am 
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Ice wrote:
Any draft insights, assuming the pick stays at 18 as it currently stands?


I know zippo about the players in the draft

What I do know that in general, anything outside the top 5 overall picks are nothing more than lottery tickets you hope hit a couple years down the line.

That's why I could give 2 shits about keeping our first rounder in the next 3-5 years while the Sid/Geno window is open. Use it as assets to acquire players and such.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:17 am 
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Donnie Brasco wrote:
Ice wrote:
Any draft insights, assuming the pick stays at 18 as it currently stands?


I know zippo about the players in the draft

What I do know that in general, anything outside the top 5 overall picks are nothing more than lottery tickets you hope hit a couple years down the line.

That's why I could give 2 shits about keeping our first rounder in the next 3-5 years while the Sid/Geno window is open. Use it as assets to acquire players and such.

The Pens are picking 21 and I have seen these names: Ryan Suzuki and Cam York in various mocks but who really knows.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:33 am 
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Both are interesting, at least according to the write ups, and look to be good value at 21. Like Donnie said, looks like they're both three years away from NHL playing time.


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:14 pm 
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Ice wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
fractalsteel wrote:
35 years ago on this day, the Penguins drafted Mario Lemieux. Things have worked out fairly well since then.
Fuck I'm old.


I turn 36 this summer. Been a heck of a life to be a Pens fan.
I think I might actually give my left nut to be 36 again. RE: pens fan? I missed the hoopla during the mario/ jagr years. But am thankful I had the opportunity to watch the back to back stanley cup run recently.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:51 am 
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COR-TEN wrote:
Ice wrote:
COR-TEN wrote:
I think I might actually give my left nut to be 36 again. RE: pens fan? I missed the hoopla during the mario/ jagr years. But am thankful I had the opportunity to watch the back to back stanley cup run recently.


Don't get me wrong, back to back recently was awesome but 2009 will always be the penultimate for me

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:40 am 
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2009 was the big one for me as well.
After taking it on the chin the year before, then losing Hossa to the enemy, the young charges got it done in 7.

Funny how there are hundreds of posts about losing a particular player on the North side and how the Steelers couldn't be a better team for it. Yet, the BIrds lost a top 20 player in Hossa and came back the next year to win the cup.
See, it can be done.

Thankfully Mario had the gumption to fire a cup winning, a set-in-his-ways coach who was wasting the franchise so that we found the spark to win it twice more.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:25 am 
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fractalsteel wrote:
2009 was the big one for me as well.
After taking it on the chin the year before, then losing Hossa to the enemy, the young charges got it done in 7.

Funny how there are hundreds of posts about losing a particular player on the North side and how the Steelers couldn't be a better team for it. Yet, the BIrds lost a top 20 player in Hossa and came back the next year to win the cup.
See, it can be done.

Thankfully Mario had the gumption to fire a cup winning, a set-in-his-ways coach who was wasting the franchise so that we found the spark to win it twice more.


This is true, but to be fair football has a whole lot more Xs and Os and coaching strategy/philosophy is much more important to football than hockey. It can take quite while for a coach to install a new system in football. Hockey it is easier to switch out a coach, and it is done often just because their message gets stale or tuned out. That can happen in football too, but the downside risk is higher. I'm fine with my football team having a longer leash than my hockey club. Though the Steelers have gone way too long with Tomlin.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:43 am 
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This never gets old. Go to the 3:20 mark for the game end call


https://www.reddit.com/r/howardstern/co ... oing_play/

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:19 pm 
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I think we have a tendency to think of football as a "more xes and o's type of game because the action is more compartmentalized, and easier to digest, particularly on TV. The more I've learned about hockey, and especially watching the game live, the more I've developed an appreciation for the complexity of what's actually going on out there. Lot of moving (fast and constantly) parts for the coach to control and adjust to, without the benefit of anywhere near the amount of built in stoppage you see in football, baseball, or even basketball.


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:13 pm 
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Ice wrote:
I think we have a tendency to think of football as a "more xes and o's type of game because the action is more compartmentalized, and easier to digest, particularly on TV. The more I've learned about hockey, and especially watching the game live, the more I've developed an appreciation for the complexity of what's actually going on out there. Lot of moving (fast and constantly) parts for the coach to control and adjust to, without the benefit of anywhere near the amount of built in stoppage you see in football, baseball, or even basketball.


Right there is why coaching impact in hockey is limited... at least the in game management. It can't be micro managed by a coach. You can install some concepts of team oriented play, but the ability to draw up precise play designs to call upon in a game is not really possible. Not to say there aren't any set plays in hockey, but the frequency they occur and likelihood of working exactly as designed is way less common than other sports. Generally other sports you have more opportunity to isolate action for individual players and attack mismatches. That is pretty hard to do in hockey. You can look to take advantage of some line matchups. but is pretty hard to scheme to say get Crosby more open ice to work with. Good schematic coaching in hockey is more about wearing down the opponent over a much longer stretch of time. For that to work your players need to be disciplined and stay on message which is probably why NHL coaches get canned so quickly. As soon as the message starts getting stale there is no real quick fix.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:31 pm 
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Quote:
The Athletic
‏Verified account @TheAthleticPGH

Penguins GM Jim Rutherford: Phil Kessel "will probably play for Pittsburgh next season."

From @JoshYohe_PGH


I don't have a subscription, so I can't share the article; but it seems as if Kessel isn't going anywhere.

I will call it a successful offseason if JJ gets moved.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:45 pm 
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SteelPro wrote:
Ice wrote:
I think we have a tendency to think of football as a "more xes and o's type of game because the action is more compartmentalized, and easier to digest, particularly on TV. The more I've learned about hockey, and especially watching the game live, the more I've developed an appreciation for the complexity of what's actually going on out there. Lot of moving (fast and constantly) parts for the coach to control and adjust to, without the benefit of anywhere near the amount of built in stoppage you see in football, baseball, or even basketball.


Right there is why coaching impact in hockey is limited... at least the in game management. It can't be micro managed by a coach. You can install some concepts of team oriented play, but the ability to draw up precise play designs to call upon in a game is not really possible. Not to say there aren't any set plays in hockey, but the frequency they occur and likelihood of working exactly as designed is way less common than other sports. Generally other sports you have more opportunity to isolate action for individual players and attack mismatches. That is pretty hard to do in hockey. You can look to take advantage of some line matchups. but is pretty hard to scheme to say get Crosby more open ice to work with. Good schematic coaching in hockey is more about wearing down the opponent over a much longer stretch of time. For that to work your players need to be disciplined and stay on message which is probably why NHL coaches get canned so quickly. As soon as the message starts getting stale there is no real quick fix.


I also agree with your earlier sentiment about the coaching differences. The message a hockey coach has to get his players to buy into is often simpler.
For Sully, it has always been about playing fast and smart and puck possession in the OZ. In some ways, Tomlin is the opposite. He wants to play it close, to ease into a contest and hope, in the end, they have a lead or a chance to grab the lead.

I have a lot of complaints about Tomlin but this really isn't the place to vent. With Sully, my issues are some of the lines he rolls with. I'd also like to see him double up with Crosby and Malkin. He only uses that dynamic on the PP or with the extra attacker. How about closing out a period with those two on the ice?


As far as Kessel remaining with the team, I firmly believe they are going to let the current team have another shot before breaking up the band. I read a Letang interview last week and he said they should keep the team together for at least another year.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:18 pm 
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SteelPro wrote:
Ice wrote:
I think we have a tendency to think of football as a "more xes and o's type of game because the action is more compartmentalized, and easier to digest, particularly on TV. The more I've learned about hockey, and especially watching the game live, the more I've developed an appreciation for the complexity of what's actually going on out there. Lot of moving (fast and constantly) parts for the coach to control and adjust to, without the benefit of anywhere near the amount of built in stoppage you see in football, baseball, or even basketball.


Right there is why coaching impact in hockey is limited... at least the in game management. It can't be micro managed by a coach. You can install some concepts of team oriented play, but the ability to draw up precise play designs to call upon in a game is not really possible. Not to say there aren't any set plays in hockey, but the frequency they occur and likelihood of working exactly as designed is way less common than other sports. Generally other sports you have more opportunity to isolate action for individual players and attack mismatches. That is pretty hard to do in hockey. You can look to take advantage of some line matchups. but is pretty hard to scheme to say get Crosby more open ice to work with. Good schematic coaching in hockey is more about wearing down the opponent over a much longer stretch of time. For that to work your players need to be disciplined and stay on message which is probably why NHL coaches get canned so quickly. As soon as the message starts getting stale there is no real quick fix.
Not disagreeing at all with what you said, but I remember a game during the back to back run where the pens needed a goal, bad, and it was very late in the game or maybe OT. But Crosby skated around and talked to specific team mates and whispered in their ears before a face off, and low and behold, won the FO, passed it twice for a score. It was weird because it looked like crosby ad hoc'd a play and drew it up before the face off. Not sure that happens a lot.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:45 pm 
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Pabst wrote:
Quote:
The Athletic
‏Verified account @TheAthleticPGH

Penguins GM Jim Rutherford: Phil Kessel "will probably play for Pittsburgh next season."

From @JoshYohe_PGH


I don't have a subscription, so I can't share the article; but it seems as if Kessel isn't going anywhere.

I will call it a successful offseason if JJ gets moved.


Between his NMC and the relatively bargain price of his deal (9 million for Skinner?), JR has probably reconsidered.

Great stuff on the coaching talk, guys.


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 4:48 pm 
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COR-TEN wrote:
SteelPro wrote:
Ice wrote:
I think we have a tendency to think of football as a "more xes and o's type of game because the action is more compartmentalized, and easier to digest, particularly on TV. The more I've learned about hockey, and especially watching the game live, the more I've developed an appreciation for the complexity of what's actually going on out there. Lot of moving (fast and constantly) parts for the coach to control and adjust to, without the benefit of anywhere near the amount of built in stoppage you see in football, baseball, or even basketball.


Right there is why coaching impact in hockey is limited... at least the in game management. It can't be micro managed by a coach. You can install some concepts of team oriented play, but the ability to draw up precise play designs to call upon in a game is not really possible. Not to say there aren't any set plays in hockey, but the frequency they occur and likelihood of working exactly as designed is way less common than other sports. Generally other sports you have more opportunity to isolate action for individual players and attack mismatches. That is pretty hard to do in hockey. You can look to take advantage of some line matchups. but is pretty hard to scheme to say get Crosby more open ice to work with. Good schematic coaching in hockey is more about wearing down the opponent over a much longer stretch of time. For that to work your players need to be disciplined and stay on message which is probably why NHL coaches get canned so quickly. As soon as the message starts getting stale there is no real quick fix.
Not disagreeing at all with what you said, but I remember a game during the back to back run where the pens needed a goal, bad, and it was very late in the game or maybe OT. But Crosby skated around and talked to specific team mates and whispered in their ears before a face off, and low and behold, won the FO, passed it twice for a score. It was weird because it looked like crosby ad hoc'd a play and drew it up before the face off. Not sure that happens a lot.


This goes on a lot in hockey. Depends on the matchups on the ice.
Sid probably felt he could win the FO to a certain area and he wanted a teammate ready to control the puck. From there they were probably trying to take advantage of something they saw prior.

When James Neal was with the Pens, Malkin often would try to win the FO cleanly and in one motion get the puck to where Neal was stationed behind him because Neal had a wicked/accurate shot that found the net or the back of the net. It worked from time to time the year Neal scored 40 goals. That was a set play.

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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:21 pm 
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Donnie Brasco wrote:
This never gets old. Go to the 3:20 mark for the game end call


https://www.reddit.com/r/howardstern/co ... oing_play/


I waited on hold the following day for an hour and a half and talked to Ferrell on his show about the win.


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 Post subject: Re: Pens/NHL Offseason Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:07 am 
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Rumors surfacing connecting the Pens to Trouba. It's a bit of a gamble with his pending employment status, as well as what the Jets appear to be asking (2 roster guys and a pick/ top prospect). Salary cap a definite issue, as well, if Phil is indeed going nowhere. Rusty/JJ/1st rounder?


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