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 Post subject: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:49 am 
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1.28 LB Lorenzo Carter, Georgia (Considered RB Derrius Guice)
There's a risk attached, because–for all his talent and athleticism, he's not plug and play at any position... but he can take snaps immediately at both off-ball LB and edge rusher. His position flexibility is what makes this pick worthwhile.
2.60 FS Jesse Bates, Wake Forest (Considered EDGE Duke Ejiofor)
Fits need and team style like a glove. Also adds significant return ability. Ejiofor works if a RB or safety picked in Rd 1)
3.90 SS Shaquem Griffin, Central Florida (Considered S Jesse Bates) Convinced he's going to be a star playmaker, and this team seriously needs playmakers.
5.148 CB Nick Nelson, Wisconsin (Considered OL Damon Harrison) Can never have enough CBs, especially good, athletic ones.
5.165 RB Kalen Ballage, Arizona State Not the best runner in the class, but going to be a much better pro than college player. And he fits this offense perfectly.
7.220 WR Richie James, Middle Tennessee State Would loved to have had the luxury to pick Anthony Miller in Rd 2, but not getting one of those first three players is too big a price tag for a #4 WR, perhaps a #3 in 2019. Richie James's price tag is much better, and his play is much better than a typical 7th rounder. Somewhere between Santonio Holmes and Eli Rogers in the style category- really good after the catch, too.
7.246 LB Skai Moore, South Carolina Other than the utter hatred of Josh Allen and mystifying downgrading of Shaquem Griffin's tape, the valuation of Skai Moore as a UDFA by NFL Draft Scout is the biggest mystery of the mock draft season. Maybe he knows something about the neck injury? Moore seemed to play at the same level afterwards and he would make a nice complement to Jon Bostic.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:08 pm 
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I would be very happy with that draft.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:39 pm 
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I had Ballage and Chris Warren pretty close before today-- reports are that Chris Warren changed his start position for the 40 and ran somewhere around 4.53 at 6020 247lbs. At that kind of speed, I think he's a better runner than Ballage, and a far, far better blocker. Might take him in rd 5.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:31 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
I had Ballage and Chris Warren pretty close before today-- reports are that Chris Warren changed his start position for the 40 and ran somewhere around 4.53 at 6020 247lbs. At that kind of speed, I think he's a better runner than Ballage, and a far, far better blocker. Might take him in rd 5.


247 is big enough that he could shed weight to gain some speed and quickness if he wanted.


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:40 pm 
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Ice wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
I had Ballage and Chris Warren pretty close before today-- reports are that Chris Warren changed his start position for the 40 and ran somewhere around 4.53 at 6020 247lbs. At that kind of speed, I think he's a better runner than Ballage, and a far, far better blocker. Might take him in rd 5.


247 is big enough that he could shed weight to gain some speed and quickness if he wanted.

Thing is: his agility and SS were top percentile. He is already very good in short area and COD. He has those Bettis quick feet in the hole. Again, I can’t figure out why draft experts aren’t all over him.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:06 pm 
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Solid B draft in my opinion. Not sure I love Lorenzo Carter in the first.


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:24 pm 
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My "fear" for lack of a better word is that Jesse Bates will be the Steelers' pick at 28. Day 2 where you have him much easier pill for me to swallow.

My guy is Lorenzo Carter. Off the charts character and leadership. Saw him play in person in high school and at Athens. Despite his 5-star status, I never thought he stood out enough during his 4 years at UGA to merit a 1st round selection although he certainly looks the part. Given my disdain for Bud Dupree, I'd be MUCH happier with him at 28 than Bates or the Reid kid.

Anyway, this looks like a Steelers type mock but I guess I am in the minority on Shaq Griffin. I just don't see the Steelers burning a day 2 pick on a player who looks best suited for a 4-3 weakside LB role like a Telvin Smith. Dig his story and makes a ton of plays despite his "handicap" I'm just not sold on the fit.

Running back has me frustrated this year in that part of me wants Bell back so a valuable early round draft pick isn't taken away from adding talent where it's more needed. The other part of me wants the Steelers to kick him and his outrageous salary demands to the curb. Assuming Bell shows up after what I'm sure will be a likely hold out, I like B2B's guy Ballage for his complimentary pass catching prowess. Totally the type of complementary back to pair with Bell. Don't sleep on Mark Walton and John Kelly on day 3 either. Value picks they are.

Oh and D-line I think is more than a minor omission. Hargrave bothers me. See him shoved around way too often. An upgrade or at least some competition is needed. But hey only so many picks to go around. Good stuff as always B2B.


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:05 pm 
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Decent try like some of the players just not where taken maybe. Can't see Bates lasting till end of 2nd. Carter is ok but have other preferences for Rd 1 like Evans or Vander Esch if going LB.

3 LBs and 2 DBs with no DL or OL help for our depth I can't see happening either.

I think if we go RB it'll be earlier like 2nd or 3rd round because they feel Bell is one year and gone. Otherwise just add a vet RB for depth purposes. I like
Guice, Michel and Kerryon Johnson early on to pair with Connor. Not fans of Warren or Ballage as I don't see either as fulltime backs.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:35 pm 
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Quote:
In a poll of five NFL executives regarding the best team-fit for UCF LB Shaquem Griffin, they offered up the Pittsburgh Steelers, Los Angeles Rams, Arizona Cardinals, New England Patriots and Baltimore Ravens.
Five executives, five different answers. NFL Media's Daniel Jeremiah -- who conducted the informal poll -- writes that he "love[s]" the 6-foot, 227-pound Griffin "as a Will linebacker in a 4-3 scheme who can make plays in space." After being widely viewed as a Day 3 selection for the draft, Griffin came out and crushed the NFL Scouting Combine (after receiving his invite very, very late) with a blazing 40-yard dash run of 4.38 seconds. He's pushing up toward Day 2 at this juncture. Jeremiah sees his draft range beginning in the third round.
Source: NFL.com Mar 28 - 3:3


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:55 pm 
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SteelDrama wrote:
My "fear" for lack of a better word is that Jesse Bates will be the Steelers' pick at 28. Day 2 where you have him much easier pill for me to swallow.



Bates is a reach at 28 but long gone before 60. If he is their target I hope they consider moving down.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:08 pm 
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Can Carter play ILB? I’ve only read about him playing outside. I would not be thrilled with him in the first.
Seems like a high bust potential.
Bates would seem to be a safer pick in the first, but in that case I hope like hell the trade down and get a 4th rounder.


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:35 pm 
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Charles Demarr wrote:
Solid B draft in my opinion. Not sure I love Lorenzo Carter in the first.

Me neither!

Picking at 28 is, pretty much every year... really hard. This year the prospects between about 25 and 75 are just about the same. I tried to pick one that fit the team's designs on D, their needs, and one who had some ability to get better.

The more I think about it today, the more I think about taking Derrius Guice there- yeah, that's right, Mr. never take a RB in the first round-but today's mood is: draft Guice, withdraw the franchise tag on Bell, pick up that 3rd round comp next year. If Chris Warren is undrafted, then sign him as UDFA, too. Beautiful and you'll hardly notice Bell was gone.

My fear, is that the Steelers will feel the necessity of drafting an ILB at 28, regardless of who's left at that point. That's going to mean Rashaan Evans. IF Evans' struggles in coverage were due to him playing with a nearly detached groin muscle for almost all of the year and IF he will fully recover and IF the medicals say it won't be a continuing problem (despite the fact that he injured the other groin musicle the year before)... then I could get behind that pick.

As I said elsewhere, the Steelers board for 1.28 looks something like this:

*Minkah Fitzpatrick *Denzel Ward *Tremaine Edmunds *Roquan Smith
*Daron Payne *Calvin Ridley *Lamar Jackson *Jaire Alexander
Isaiah Wynn *Ronnie Harrison *Sam Hubbard *Derrius Guice DJ Chark Gesicki Lorenzo Carter Billy Price Mason Rudolph *Arden Key Sony Michel
Anthony Averett DaShawn Hand Marcus Allen Nick Chubb James Washington *Donte Jackson
Duke Ejiofor *Jerome Baker Trenton Thompson Tony Brown *Tim Settle *Terrell Edmunds *Kevin Tolliver DaeSean Hamilton *Jesse Bates

I've been doing this a while-- this is neither the worst group I've ever seen the Steelers consider for their 1st pick nor a group filled with slam-dunk candidates.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:37 pm 
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Big Steel wrote:
Decent try like some of the players just not where taken maybe. Can't see Bates lasting till end of 2nd. Carter is ok but have other preferences for Rd 1 like Evans or Vander Esch if going LB.

3 LBs and 2 DBs with no DL or OL help for our depth I can't see happening either.

I think if we go RB it'll be earlier like 2nd or 3rd round because they feel Bell is one year and gone. Otherwise just add a vet RB for depth purposes. I like
Guice, Michel and Kerryon Johnson early on to pair with Connor. Not fans of Warren or Ballage as I don't see either as fulltime backs.

Bates is listed by nfldraftscout as an early 4th round pick! I'm with you, I think he'll go sooner, and totally could be the pick at 28. He checks ALL the boxes. Underclassman, productive in power 5, dinner with him at pro day, position of need.

I think LVE is long gone by 28, or I'd take him. Evans had serious trouble this year in coverage and the excuse is a severe groin injury which, if true, then he's a guy with two serious groin injuries in two years.

I'm not sure Ballard would be a full time back, but I think Warren will be for some smart team. He'll be money on 3rd down and also 4th and short. He's not quite as fast as Marshaun Lynch but he's in that territory, and has quicker feet, to my eye.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:44 pm 
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SteelDrama wrote:
My "fear" for lack of a better word is that Jesse Bates will be the Steelers' pick at 28. Day 2 where you have him much easier pill for me to swallow.

My guy is Lorenzo Carter. Off the charts character and leadership. Saw him play in person in high school and at Athens. Despite his 5-star status, I never thought he stood out enough during his 4 years at UGA to merit a 1st round selection although he certainly looks the part. Given my disdain for Bud Dupree, I'd be MUCH happier with him at 28 than Bates or the Reid kid.

Anyway, this looks like a Steelers type mock but I guess I am in the minority on Shaq Griffin. I just don't see the Steelers burning a day 2 pick on a player who looks best suited for a 4-3 weakside LB role like a Telvin Smith. Dig his story and makes a ton of plays despite his "handicap" I'm just not sold on the fit.

Running back has me frustrated this year in that part of me wants Bell back so a valuable early round draft pick isn't taken away from adding talent where it's more needed. The other part of me wants the Steelers to kick him and his outrageous salary demands to the curb. Assuming Bell shows up after what I'm sure will be a likely hold out, I like B2B's guy Ballage for his complimentary pass catching prowess. Totally the type of complementary back to pair with Bell. Don't sleep on Mark Walton and John Kelly on day 3 either. Value picks they are.

Oh and D-line I think is more than a minor omission. Hargrave bothers me. See him shoved around way too often. An upgrade or at least some competition is needed. But hey only so many picks to go around. Good stuff as always B2B.

DLine in this draft is nearly devoid of guys who are good fits for the Steelers needs. Vea will go before 28. end of 3rd is too soon for Fatakusi and early 5th is too late. I think. The really good prospects seem like 3 techs and 5 techs. Not too many 1 techs who are more than space eaters, and even those don't seem to have a lot of power or a big butt or what have you.

I'm not sure about where Carter is *now* but this would be a bet on where he will be by end of year 3. as I said in the other post... I'm still not sure about it.

Unlike you, I'm okay with Bates at 28. I think he's better than advertised and fills a position of extreme need in a perfectly complementary way to Burnett.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:51 pm 
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If the Steelers are looking at a space eating NT this draft has some good ones. I just do not know what they are looking for anymore.

Harrison Phillips, Derrick Nnadi,Tim Settle, Poona Ford.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:54 pm 
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cop1211 wrote:
Can Carter play ILB? I’ve only read about him playing outside. I would not be thrilled with him in the first.
Seems like a high bust potential.
Bates would seem to be a safer pick in the first, but in that case I hope like hell the trade down and get a 4th rounder.

Much like jarvis, Carter basically plays off-ball now. He plays more or less what Von Miller and Vic Beasley do-- he's an Off-Ball LB who blitzes or rushes on 3rd downs. Personally, I think he might have more potential as an off-ball guy, but the longer this discussion goes on, the less enthusiastic I am about drafting a 1st round pick with so many questions about where he will play. But, then, that was Lawrence Timmons to a T.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:00 pm 
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jebrick wrote:
If the Steelers are looking at a space eating NT this draft has some good ones. I just do not know what they are looking for anymore.

Harrison Phillips, Derrick Nnadi,Tim Settle, Poona Ford.

I think Tim Settle is perfect. He's going to go about pick 40. So, how would you feel about Tim Settle at 28? Can't see them doing it... and although I considered it for like 5 minutes in the board draft and for like 10 seconds in this mock, I couldn't pull the trigger on such a boom/bust guy, even if he epitomizes planet theory.

Harrison Phillips is a made to order 5 tech. Nnadi's lack of explosion AND lack of movement skills doom him. Poona's a good player but I can't imagine he'll hold up with his lack of length. I could be wrong. I'd say Vita Vea, Settle, Fatukasi, maybe Senat are the guys I could see. I'm not so into the Alabama guys, but Payne might work as a limited snaps player. I'm not sure I see the value in it. I think Settle and Fatukasi could see lots of snaps along the line and in packages.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:13 pm 
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Quote:
I guess I am in the minority on Shaq Griffin. I just don't see the Steelers burning a day 2 pick on a player who looks best suited for a 4-3 weakside LB role like a Telvin Smith. Dig his story and makes a ton of plays despite his "handicap" I'm just not sold on the fit.

I think Jeremiah and those who think Griffin is a Will backer in a 4-3 are small-thinking this thing. Griffin is a guy you line up all over the field and give the keys to the kingdom. He may not be a HOFer like Troy, but that's the role for him. In 3 game films from 2017 film alone, I saw him:

1. fly in from off ball to blow up a run play deep in the backfield
2. use a newly learned spin move to cleanly defeat a quality SEC LT and make a sack about 2 seconds after the snap
3. cover the other team's best WR-- a speed WR/KR with good size-- carry him with blanket coverage 40 yards downfield, play the ball in the air better than that WR, pull down the INT
4. hold leverage on an OT to stretch out a run play for a loss
5. spy a running QB and outrun him to the edge for a sack
6. beat his man cleanly to the inside gap and block a FG in the conference championship game to save a perfect season
7. Amass 21 tackles, 3.5 sacks, 6.5 TFL, 1 FF, 1 INT, 3 PD

I think we can agree that he's a playmaker-- line him up anywhere and the kid is going to make plays.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:33 pm 
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If there was ever a year to trade down, this is the year. Very few surefire prospects this year, and they are all going to go in the top 20 picks.

At this point, I have no clue who the 1st round pick is going to be.

I think I know who the 2nd round pick will be, but I'm not saying until we submit our entries for the SF pick the draft picks competition.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:51 pm 
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I like Hill and Jones from NC State as DT/NT prospects.


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 9:45 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
jebrick wrote:
If the Steelers are looking at a space eating NT this draft has some good ones. I just do not know what they are looking for anymore.

Harrison Phillips, Derrick Nnadi,Tim Settle, Poona Ford.

I think Tim Settle is perfect. He's going to go about pick 40. So, how would you feel about Tim Settle at 28? Can't see them doing it... and although I considered it for like 5 minutes in the board draft and for like 10 seconds in this mock, I couldn't pull the trigger on such a boom/bust guy, even if he epitomizes planet theory.

Harrison Phillips is a made to order 5 tech. Nnadi's lack of explosion AND lack of movement skills doom him. Poona's a good player but I can't imagine he'll hold up with his lack of length. I could be wrong. I'd say Vita Vea, Settle, Fatukasi, maybe Senat are the guys I could see. I'm not so into the Alabama guys, but Payne might work as a limited snaps player. I'm not sure I see the value in it. I think Settle and Fatukasi could see lots of snaps along the line and in packages.

He will get drafted well before pick 28 so no point in debating it but B2B you're WAY underselling Da'Ron Payne imo. Kid's a STUD.
Tim Settle was a kid I really liked but man he looked really sloppy at the combine. Tape matters most, but he looked awful. A slide to day 3 wouldn't shock me.
I think Ken Norton's kid could be a sleeper pick with Karl Dunbar visiting the 'Canes pro day.


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:30 pm 
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cop1211 wrote:
I like Hill and Jones from NC State as DT/NT prospects.

I think those guys are pretty good-- but it's hard to know considering the overall talent on that line overwhelming OLs.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 8:35 am 
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A quick mock this morning....

@ 28 Leighton Vander Esch
@ 60 Jesse Bates III
@ 92 Jaylen Samuels
@ 148 B.J. Hill
@ 165 Fred Warner
@ 176 Alex Cappa
@ 246 Durham Smythe


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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:06 am 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:

Harrison Phillips is a made to order 5 tech. Nnadi's lack of explosion AND lack of movement skills doom him. Poona's a good player but I can't imagine he'll hold up with his lack of length. I could be wrong. I'd say Vita Vea, Settle, Fatukasi, maybe Senat are the guys I could see. I'm not so into the Alabama guys, but Payne might work as a limited snaps player. I'm not sure I see the value in it. I think Settle and Fatukasi could see lots of snaps along the line and in packages.


Phillips is only 6'3 which does not fit into the Standard Steeler DE ( that being 6'5) but he does have all the attributes to make a good 0/1 tech.
Ford has those outrageously long arms and is built like a bowling ball. He also plays very low.

Again, I am not sure what the Steelers are looking for any more at NT. If we go to the player that you must double then ( outside Vea), Phillips is outstanding.

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 Post subject: Re: This Is The Mock I Have Today... Long Way To Go
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 10:01 am 
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I think Payne is better suited to not being a nose tackle, too. He's also underaged. But my question is: do Harrison and Payne as NTs make this defense better? How much better? For how many snaps a game? I think both have strengths but I think they're going to go too early because the draft doesn't have many outlier big men. And, next year is going to be a big man DL extravaganza, if the guys who are expected to come out come out. Like 3 easy 1st rounders pushing down a Vita Vea type to late 1st, early 2nd.

To me, Settle is a little different. He's super young, not just in age but I think in maturity as a person/body. He's a freak-- even his poor combine showing had elements of freakishness. It looked like he's never practiced a drill in his life. He has dynamism on tape that none of the other guys mentioned had. Boom or bust, to be sure, but the boom side is Ngata/Fat Casey territory.

I'm way more worried about Sean Davis having to cover a WR from off man in quarters/Red Zone than I am about Hargrave's down sophomore year. The situation isn't perfect at NT but they have some bodies to throw at it. Safety is still a clusterfuck.

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