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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:58 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
nfldraftscout currently has Harrison Phillips as a 1st round pick.


I have him easily as a top 50 pick

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:19 pm 
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I was as surprised as you guys. I forgot the link fellas. My Bad. http://walterfootball.com/mocks/nfl/201 ... h-steelers


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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:48 pm 
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Here is a cutout of the actual board draft of the first round. If the Steelers stayed put at 28 or traded out for a second round pick like B2B did; who else here that fell in this area would you take for the Steelers other than Lorenzo Carter??? (Outside of Rashaan Evans because I'm thinking Evans vs Carter would be about a 50/50 split) Who is better than Carter between picks 28 thru 37 from this list???

1 23 LAR - sgtrobo - Jaire Alexander, CB, Louisville
1 24 CAR - ohmegosh - Courtland Sutton, WR, Southern Methodist
1 25 TEN - Ironzabo - Rashaan Evans LB Alabama
1 26 ATL - Jobus Rum - Taven Bryant DT Florida Gators.
1 27 NOR - ol skool - Harold Landry of Boston College
1 28 CLE (fr PIT) - SP - Calvin Ridley, WR, Alabama
1 29 JAX - cop1211 - Mike McGlinchey, OT, Notre Dame
1 30 MIN - mick - Connor Williams, OT, Texas
1 31 NE - TB - Mike Hughes, CB, Central Florida
1 32 PHI - Ice - Lorenzo Carter, OLB/ILB/EDGE, UGA.
2 33 CLE- SP - Justin Reid, FS, Stanford
2 34 NYG - JackLambert58 - Josh Jackson, CB, Iowa
2 35 CLE- SP - Mark Andrews, TE, Oklahoma
2 36 IND - jebrick - Isaiah Wynn, OG, Georgia
2 37 PIT (fr NYJ via CLE) - B2B - Shaquem Griffin, S/LB, Central Florida
2 38 TB - OhioSteeler - Will Hernandez, G, Texas El-Paso
2 39 CHI - sheppardmj- Isaiah Oliver, CB, Colorado
2 40 DEN - pitty smitty - DJ Chark, WR, LSU


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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:17 pm 
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I’d rather take Reid, or Jackson, than Carter.


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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:39 am 
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cop1211 wrote:
I’d rather take Reid, or Jackson, than Carter.

Jackson is a straight up zone CB. He's great at it and would have been a wonderful fit in the cover 3 days.

Reid and maybe Carter. I don't much care for anyone selected in the board draft from 24 though

Harrison Phillips, maybe? Otherwise CBs, OL, RBs, WRs... not too many safeties, ILB, edge guys at that point that seemed like good value.

FWIW, I think Shaquem Griffin is a better football player than Reid now, and will be in the NFL, as well. There's some risk involved but I like Griffin's chances as a playmaker. I'll take Griffin-Goedert-Miller-Nwosu over Reid-Nwosu-Griffin maybe or Carter-Griffin-Ronald Jones

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:32 am 
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Carter/Griffin/Miller would work for me. If Bell isn't in the long term cards, Carter/Griffin/Rojo.


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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:27 am 
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Ice wrote:
Carter/Griffin/Miller would work for me. If Bell isn't in the long term cards, Carter/Griffin/Rojo.

I thought about it overnight, and if I can't trade out of 1.28, I'm up for Reid-Nwosu-Griffin or Carter-Nwosu-Griffin (I'd play Carter primarily as ILB and Nwosu primarily as edge, but I think both players are position-flexible.

The Steelers, I think, are more interested than I am in adding a FS and in keeping Davis at SS. After Reid and maybe Bates, it's a long way down to Blanding and the kid from Northwestern. Blanding seems like a good Steelers prediction... he's a productive player with pretty much no splash and fewer mistakes than some of the others. I don't think there's anything special about him except for maybe his tackling, yet I think he'll be an average NFL starter for several years. High floor, low ceiling. Same with Quenton Meeks, who I think will be an effective and totally unspectacular safety in the NFL. Going to play smart football (coach's kid and film junkie) and tackle well... he might be more attractive to the Steelers that the up and down Reid, honestly.

There are a couple of interesting guys later with higher ceilings and lower floors, too, but that's not really their style-- or at least hasn't been other than Gerod Holliman.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:31 am 
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I'll be honest-- while I'm high on Lorenzo Carter, he's a risk not unlike Dupree. Super athlete who made more plays than Kentucky Dupree, but is a real tweener, without classic edge rush trait nor experience playing inside. I think Nwosu has a similar toolkit but arguably better burst and instincts that make him look faster than he is.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:30 am 
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I think Carter will not give the quick Edge rush skills at first but has shown the ability to cover and set the edge. The question will be can you project him to learn the pass rushing skills? Dupree has been ok in pass rushing but can't set the edge.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:32 am 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
Ice wrote:
Carter/Griffin/Miller would work for me. If Bell isn't in the long term cards, Carter/Griffin/Rojo.

I thought about it overnight, and if I can't trade out of 1.28, I'm up for Reid-Nwosu-Griffin or Carter-Nwosu-Griffin (I'd play Carter primarily as ILB and Nwosu primarily as edge, but I think both players are position-flexible.

The Steelers, I think, are more interested than I am in adding a FS and in keeping Davis at SS. After Reid and maybe Bates, it's a long way down to Blanding and the kid from Northwestern. Blanding seems like a good Steelers prediction... he's a productive player with pretty much no splash and fewer mistakes than some of the others. I don't think there's anything special about him except for maybe his tackling, yet I think he'll be an average NFL starter for several years. High floor, low ceiling. Same with Quenton Meeks, who I think will be an effective and totally unspectacular safety in the NFL. Going to play smart football (coach's kid and film junkie) and tackle well... he might be more attractive to the Steelers that the up and down Reid, honestly.

There are a couple of interesting guys later with higher ceilings and lower floors, too, but that's not really their style-- or at least hasn't been other than Gerod Holliman.


Reid bothers me in his lack of instincts. He has the athletic ability to play a CF FS type but not the instincts. He will play it slower than his speed. He is also very grabby in coverage.

I am a fan of Bates.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:01 pm 
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PFF nailed Dupree being a bust. The dude only gots sacks and pressures against the worst of the worst tackles in D1 in school. I remember on draft night thinking "Well, at least Dupree will be gone before our pick, glad someone else will take the bullet for him." :lol: Ugh. Sometimes guys fall for a reason.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:58 pm 
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jebrick wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Ice wrote:
Carter/Griffin/Miller would work for me. If Bell isn't in the long term cards, Carter/Griffin/Rojo.

I thought about it overnight, and if I can't trade out of 1.28, I'm up for Reid-Nwosu-Griffin or Carter-Nwosu-Griffin (I'd play Carter primarily as ILB and Nwosu primarily as edge, but I think both players are position-flexible.

The Steelers, I think, are more interested than I am in adding a FS and in keeping Davis at SS. After Reid and maybe Bates, it's a long way down to Blanding and the kid from Northwestern. Blanding seems like a good Steelers prediction... he's a productive player with pretty much no splash and fewer mistakes than some of the others. I don't think there's anything special about him except for maybe his tackling, yet I think he'll be an average NFL starter for several years. High floor, low ceiling. Same with Quenton Meeks, who I think will be an effective and totally unspectacular safety in the NFL. Going to play smart football (coach's kid and film junkie) and tackle well... he might be more attractive to the Steelers that the up and down Reid, honestly.

There are a couple of interesting guys later with higher ceilings and lower floors, too, but that's not really their style-- or at least hasn't been other than Gerod Holliman.


Reid bothers me in his lack of instincts. He has the athletic ability to play a CF FS type but not the instincts. He will play it slower than his speed. He is also very grabby in coverage.

I am a fan of Bates.

Tackling and angles problems. Imagine Sean Davis if Davis had better ball skills, hands, and return game.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:00 pm 
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TB wrote:
PFF nailed Dupree being a bust. The dude only gots sacks and pressures against the worst of the worst tackles in D1 in school. I remember on draft night thinking "Well, at least Dupree will be gone before our pick, glad someone else will take the bullet for him." :lol: Ugh. Sometimes guys fall for a reason.

Dupree's not a bust. He's not a great pass rusher not leverage player yet (I guess jury is still out)-- but his production rivals the majority of similarly drafted edge players over the past few years. He's still pretty likely to have a double-digit sack season if they use him to rush more. He's basically been turned into a even front SAM backer 50% of the time.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:07 pm 
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Speaking of Bud and Edge rushers, I read somewhere the Broncos may consider trading Shane Ray as Barrett and Davis have both come on.

If true, would any of you guys consider it and at what cost? Would you give up this years' 3rd or maybe one of next years 2nd, 3rd or 4th? I think I would.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:08 pm 
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DP39 wrote:
Speaking of Bud and Edge rushers, I read somewhere the Broncos may consider trading Shane Ray as Barrett and Davis have both come on.

If true, would any of you guys consider it and at what cost? Would you give up this years' 3rd or maybe one of next years 2nd, 3rd or 4th? I think I would.

I would...Steelers won’t...

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:31 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
Dupree's not a bust. He's not a great pass rusher not leverage player yet (I guess jury is still out)-- but his production rivals the majority of similarly drafted edge players over the past few years. He's still pretty likely to have a double-digit sack season if they use him to rush more. He's basically been turned into a even front SAM backer 50% of the time.



I agree Dupree is not a bust. I keep telling people this but it does not matter if we had Von Miller, the huge sack production is not coming back from our OLBs. How can it? If you are using your 3-4 OLBs more as 4-3 OLBs, dropping them into coverage so much, giving them fewer opportunities to rush the QB, how are they supposed to have double digit sacks?

Didn't TJ Watt drop into coverage some 200 snaps? With two games remaining PFF had reported that he had dropped 154 times into coverage and had only given up a passer rating of 34.7. At that point it was the 2nd highest total for an edge defender, and for a rookie to boot. Dupree? I read where he had 137 drops into coverage, which was in the top 5 for edge players.

So, the Steelers had two starting 3-4 OLBs that combined for 13 sacks and everybody here is ready to proclaim them losers, busts. And yet, they were the 2nd and 5th rated edge players in terms of percentage dropping into coverage.

Gee, I don't know, does anybody here really think that Harrison and Woodley would have collected 27.5 sacks in 2008 if hey had spent even more time dropping into pass coverage? I know that year they combined for some 700 pass rush attempts and they did drop in coverage but not to the extent that Watt and Dupree did this past year. It appears to me that the 2017 OLB duo MAY have had 475-500 attempts combined, maybe. I say maybe because the other OLBs on the team, Chick, Harrison and Moats combined for nearly 400 defensive snaps and took away opportunities from both Watt and Dupree. Back in 2008 care to guess how many snaps Patrick Bailey and Andre Frazier had on defense? They were not taking any snaps away from Deebo or Woodley.

Drafting an edge rusher is not the answer to the problem and it never will be. Dupree and Watt are perfect for what the Steelers want their 3-4 OLBs to be, they want them to be more like 4-3 OLBs. They want to have a more holistic approach to pass rushing, to have the defensive line be more productive.

Any improvements in the pass rush is going to come from that defensive line, from Stephon Tuitt and Javon Hargrave. I think they can join Heyward and we can get 30 sacks a year from that trio. Hiring Karl Dunbar, someone more familiar with 4-3 techniques and teachings will help them realize their potential.

Just don't understand how people still are clamoring for that classic 3-4 pass rushing OLB when it is obvious that they have moved on from featuring and supporting that type of player in the defense.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:46 am 
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Quote:
Walt's Pittsburgh Steelers Mock Selections
Rd. 1, Pk. 28 Leighton Vander Esch, ILB, Boise State

I've had the Steelers taking Lamar Jackson in my previous updates, but with Ben Roethlisberger saying that he wants to play for three more years, it makes sense for the front office to look elsewhere.

Pittsburgh obviously needs to replace Ryan Shazier, who won't play in 2018. The team reportedly likes Leighton Vander Esch, who did not disappoint in the combine.


Rd. 2, Pk. 28 Jesse Bates, S, Wake Forest
Excluding linebacker, in the wake of Ryan Shazier's injury, safety is the top need for the Steelers, so that has to be addressed early.

Pick change; previously Justin Reid, S


Rd. 3, Pk. 28 Kalen Ballage, RB, Arizona State


Le'Veon Bell may not be in Pittsburgh beyond this season, so I could see the Steelers adding an insurance policy.


Rd. 5, Pk. 11 Harrison Phillips, DT/3-4DE/NT, Stanford


The Steelers could stand to add better depth behind Stephon Tuitt and Cameron Heyward.


Rd. 5, Pk. 28 Steve Ishmael, WR, Syracuse


There are reports circulating about the Steelers potentially trading Martavis Bryant, so here's a possible replacement.

http://walterfootball.com/mocks/nfl/201 ... r1frTjH.99

Charlie's 3 RND mock draft...

Rashaan Evans
The Steelers could use more linebacker talent, and hopefully, Evans will pair with Ryan Shazier in a year's time to give Pittsburgh a nasty tandem on the inside.

In 2017, Evans totaled 74 tackles, 13 tackles for a loss, six sacks, one forced fumble and three passes broken up. The 6-foot-2, 232-pounder possesses an impressive skill set with size and speed. The senior did well rushing off the edge for Alabama in 2017. Evans was a backup in 2014 and 2015 before rotating onto the field during the 2016 season. As a junior, he totaled 53 tackles with 4.5 tackles for a loss, four sacks, two passes broken up and one forced fumble. Some teams have medical concerns with Evans.
http://walterfootball.com/draft2018char ... ePvtEQa.99

Terrell Edmunds
Edmunds hasn't gotten as much attention as his brother Tremaine Edmunds, but NFL sources have told WalterFootball.com that Terrell Edmunds really impressed them as well. The 6-foot, 217-pounder has good size to be an NFL safety and displayed coverage skills over the past few seasons. Edmunds played well in 2017 with 59 tackles, two interceptions and four passes broken up. As a sophomore, he totaled 89 tackles, four interceptions and three passes broken up. Sources say they see Terrell Edmunds grading out as a second-day prospect for the 2018 NFL Draft.
http://walterfootball.com/draft2018char ... si1YCJf.99

Lorenzo Carter
The Steelers could use a third edge rusher to go with T.J. Watt and Bud Dupree.

Carter (6-6, 242) was improved as a senior and is still full of athletic potential. He showed dangerous edge-rushing skills against Notre Dame and made a lot of big plays to help the Bulldogs win in South Bend. Sources say they are giving Carter third- or fourth-round grades, although the team that likes him enough to draft him could take him earlier.

In 2017, Carter totaled 61 tackles with 4.5 sacks, three forced fumbles and 7.5 tackles for a loss. He recorded 44 tackles with five sacks and two forced fumbles in 2016. Carter notched 4.5 sacks as a freshman.
http://walterfootball.com/draft2018char ... PTFmlsc.99



Honestly, if Charlie's mock comes through and the Steelers draft Evans, Edmunds and Carter I'll be stoked. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:40 am 
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I would take both mocks.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:11 am 
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I prefer Charlie's first 3 picks over Walts. That said, I think Carter may be long gone by the 3rd RND. If Carter was there in the 2nd RND I steal him and look at safety in the 3rd RND. Although, with Bostic and Burnett [about to sign, hasn't officially yet] on the roster this gives Pittsburgh a lot more freedom to draft BPA. I do like the idea of a good RB prospect in the second day of the draft too.


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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 1:09 pm 
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I like Terrell Edmunds and don’t mind him as a late day 2 pick... but if anyone can explain to me how he’s a better NFL SS than Shaquem Griffin, I would love to hear about it.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 2:09 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
I like Terrell Edmunds and don’t mind him as a late day 2 pick... but if anyone can explain to me how he’s a better NFL SS than Shaquem Griffin, I would love to hear about it.


Two hands

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 2:15 pm 
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jebrick wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
I like Terrell Edmunds and don’t mind him as a late day 2 pick... but if anyone can explain to me how he’s a better NFL SS than Shaquem Griffin, I would love to hear about it.


Two hands

Terrell is not as good with his two as Shaquem is with his one. Maybe Terrell’s second one gets in the way?

Seriously, though, I feel like everyone heard the kid has one hand, so they never bothered to watch him play.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 2:35 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
jebrick wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
I like Terrell Edmunds and don’t mind him as a late day 2 pick... but if anyone can explain to me how he’s a better NFL SS than Shaquem Griffin, I would love to hear about it.


Two hands

Terrell is not as good with his two as Shaquem is with his one. Maybe Terrell’s second one gets in the way?

Seriously, though, I feel like everyone heard the kid has one hand, so they never bothered to watch him play.


I have and if he had 2 hands he would picked in the teens. Think about Shazier's interceptions and think how many of those Griffin would have made. At least he is abetter tackler than Shazier mainly because he has to be because of his missing hand.

But in the 3rd round I would take Griffin over Edmunds

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:19 am 
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Terrell Edmunds
35G, 196 tackles, 8.5 TFL, 1.5 sack, 6 INT, 14 PD, 2 FR, 1 FF

Shaquem Griffin
37G, 191 tackles, 33.5 TFL, 18.5 sack, 3 INT, 16 PD, 5 FR, 4 FF

I mean, both are productive players but only one of them can cover a size/speed WR from the slot, 1 on 1 AND blitz like his hair is on fire.

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 Post subject: Re: Random Mocks...
PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:47 am 
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Edmunds id way over rated based on projection. He is an athletic 19 year old. who has a high ceiling. He is not football smart.

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