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 Post subject: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:42 pm 
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The new Steeler fan's math. Thanks to Art II and Mikey T's decade of futility, that's all that's left.

At least, thank God, today I went for a nice long lunch and shoe shopping with my daughter after church instead of watching that abomination of a "championship" . . .

I'm sure we're just a good draft pick or two away from ring #7 next year, right Art?

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:46 pm 
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Art needs to call in those favors now, it’s time we get our easy pass even with the circus in town :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:03 am 
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It's simple, fire Tomlin and bring in a new solid head coach and staff. For sure Tomlin has proven he is not the guy.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:07 am 
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Hard to give a shit when the two best teams in the NFL - PIT and NO - were both fucked outta here by the refs.

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:45 am 
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Does any Steeler fan think any Pats team would beat say the 1978 Steelers? I personally think we would beat the shit out of them. THAT was and always will be the greatest Nfl dynasty of all time.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:03 am 
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It would not be close.

1. Hall of Fame players -- Bradshaw, Harris, Webster, Swann, Stallworth, Greene, Ham, Lambert, Blount. Frankly, LC and Shell should be in as well but for the anti-Steelers bias (I might even make a case for Wagner). How many Patriots from the last two decades?

2. The 1970's, especially the first half of the decade, were brutal. Take the Steelers out of the equation. The Raiders, Dolphins, and most of the then AFC Central would have beaten the shit out of Brady. He would have been routinely knocked on his privileged ass and, by the end of maybe 5 years would have likely been getting on with his life's work. Now, put the Steelers into the equation -- Joe Greene with the stunt-4-3 would have been on Brady before he got his 3-step drop. Roger Staubach was no slouch and had a pretty smart HC in Landry. They ran the shotgun. In big games when the games were on the line Roger was sacked and prone to turnovers. Roger did his best AFTER the Steelers had the game in hand late in the 4th quarter. Brady would have been no better in a shotgun.

3. What would Belichick have taken away from Noll. Noll would have trapped the Pats to death with Bleier leading Harris through the holes. That would have set up the play action to Swann or Stallworth. If you double team them both who covers the TE or Harris out of the backfield. BTW, Noll was no idiot having been a player under Paul Brown and an assistant coach under both Sid Gillman and Don Shula. And as for cheating, remember the story about a clubhouse guy @ 3-Rivers who found an Oilers playbook left behind by a player. It was given to Noll. Noll showed it to his team and dumped it into the trash saying, "It doesn't matter what the Oilers do, it only matters what we do."

4. Remember from 1971 to 1980 there were FOUR teams with 2+ titles -- Steelers 4, Cowboys 2, Dolphins 2, Raiders 2. Any one of those teams would have outclassed the Patriots IMHO. Now, factor in Shula and the Dolphins twice a season -- not exactly like the AFC East of today. Now, factor in the Colts who were pretty decent in the mid-1970s (Marchibroda, Bert Jones, the Sack Pack). Point is it wouldn't be the cake walk it's been for the Patriots recently.

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:09 am 
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No doubt the ‘78 Steelers were a much sexier team with all those Hall-of-Famers, but before you run around saying any team from the 70s would have beaten the Patriots tonight, you might want to check the weight of the offensive and defensive lines for teams then and now.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:12 am 
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Will-the-Shake wrote:
No doubt the ‘78 Steelers were a much sexier team with all those Hall-of-Famers, but before you run around saying any team from the 70s would have beaten the Patriots tonight, you might want to check the weight of the offensive and defensive lines for teams then and now.

I consider this a valid argument. However, consider that in the 70's there were only 26 and then 28 teams in the league. With 32 teams in the league, talent is much more dilute now. This Patriots team is more dilute in talent than the best teams of the 70's.

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:52 am 
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Bling Collector Ben wrote:
It would not be close.

1. Hall of Fame players -- Bradshaw, Harris, Webster, Swann, Stallworth, Greene, Ham, Lambert, Blount. Frankly, LC and Shell should be in as well but for the anti-Steelers bias (I might even make a case for Wagner). How many Patriots from the last two decades?

2. The 1970's, especially the first half of the decade, were brutal. Take the Steelers out of the equation. The Raiders, Dolphins, and most of the then AFC Central would have beaten the shit out of Brady. He would have been routinely knocked on his privileged ass and, by the end of maybe 5 years would have likely been getting on with his life's work. Now, put the Steelers into the equation -- Joe Greene with the stunt-4-3 would have been on Brady before he got his 3-step drop. Roger Staubach was no slouch and had a pretty smart HC in Landry. They ran the shotgun. In big games when the games were on the line Roger was sacked and prone to turnovers. Roger did his best AFTER the Steelers had the game in hand late in the 4th quarter. Brady would have been no better in a shotgun.

3. What would Belichick have taken away from Noll. Noll would have trapped the Pats to death with Bleier leading Harris through the holes. That would have set up the play action to Swann or Stallworth. If you double team them both who covers the TE or Harris out of the backfield. BTW, Noll was no idiot having been a player under Paul Brown and an assistant coach under both Sid Gillman and Don Shula. And as for cheating, remember the story about a clubhouse guy @ 3-Rivers who found an Oilers playbook left behind by a player. It was given to Noll. Noll showed it to his team and dumped it into the trash saying, "It doesn't matter what the Oilers do, it only matters what we do."

4. Remember from 1971 to 1980 there were FOUR teams with 2+ titles -- Steelers 4, Cowboys 2, Dolphins 2, Raiders 2. Any one of those teams would have outclassed the Patriots IMHO. Now, factor in Shula and the Dolphins twice a season -- not exactly like the AFC East of today. Now, factor in the Colts who were pretty decent in the mid-1970s (Marchibroda, Bert Jones, the Sack Pack). Point is it wouldn't be the cake walk it's been for the Patriots recently.

Great post! I just said these very things to a bunch of Pats fans i was debating with on Facebook. Their comeback was, well we have kept our dynasty in the era of Free Agency, which is much harder to do. They also said with todays rules the Pats would beat us. I think we would destroy them in any decade on any field. I dont think they beat the 80s Niners or the 90s Cowboys either....


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:45 am 
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Unfortunately, they are tied with the Steelers at 6 Super Bowls. I didn't watch. Couldn't bring myself to watch and be miserable. I didn't even know who won until coming here this morning. Sucks! The NFL proved itself scripted [in the least] especially after the Rams/Saints fiasco. We've seen it for years. Labeled foil-hat wearing conspiracy theorists. The cats are outta the bag now.

Stop living in the past folks. This is the NFL today. Patriots are what's invogue. I hate it as much if not more than anyone. Makes me wonder who the next "blessed" franchise will be. I think the Patriots have lost their shine by most football fans. The NFL will have to elect a new "chosen one" sooner than later.

That said, what the fuck have teams done to unseat the fuckers? Nothing. What the fuck has been done to make sure assholes like the Patriots don't even make the postseason? Nothing. Jealousy, envy..., Really?! That team has been allowed to be in these situations by the league. Time was long ago to make a change. I imagine viewership was not that good. Anyone have the number? The game looked like it sucked out loud 13-3?

Fuck the cheats....

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:14 am 
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who cares? The fact is that New England owns the Steelers and owns the league now too. I don’t see the Steelers brain trust good enough to turn things around. Hope they prove me wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:44 am 
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Will-the-Shake wrote:
No doubt the ‘78 Steelers were a much sexier team with all those Hall-of-Famers, but before you run around saying any team from the 70s would have beaten the Patriots tonight, you might want to check the weight of the offensive and defensive lines for teams then and now.

When comparing GOAT you don't consider how the actual players would perform against each other if they where magically brought to a field together now. You only consider what they did in their own time.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:47 am 
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Bling Collector Ben wrote:
3. What would Belichick have taken away from Noll. Noll would have trapped the Pats to death with Bleier leading Harris through the holes. That would have set up the play action to Swann or Stallworth. If you double team them both who covers the TE or Harris out of the backfield. BTW, Noll was no idiot having been a player under Paul Brown and an assistant coach under both Sid Gillman and Don Shula. And as for cheating, remember the story about a clubhouse guy @ 3-Rivers who found an Oilers playbook left behind by a player. It was given to Noll. Noll showed it to his team and dumped it into the trash saying, "It doesn't matter what the Oilers do, it only matters what we do."



When I looked at Belechik last night I saw Noll, emotionless, cerebral, focused, no nonsense, BB is way closer to being Noll than either Cowher or Tomlin could ever dream of.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:52 am 
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Fuck EMR
Fuck Mike Tomlin

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:58 am 
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They got 6 in half the time, in an era where supposedly there should be no dynasties.

You can marshal any argument you want...it’ll fall on deaf ears.

So you’re doing it to make yourselves feel better...that’s all.

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:08 am 
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This...
Suwanee88 wrote:
who cares? The fact is that New England owns the Steelers and owns the league now too. I don’t see the Steelers brain trust good enough to turn things around. Hope they prove me wrong.

and this.
Quote:
When comparing GOAT you don't consider how the actual players would perform against each other if they where magically brought to a field together now. You only consider what they did in their own time.


Stop clinging to something that happened 4+ decades ago.
It was 4+ decades ago...

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:40 am 
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Look, there is no doubt the Pats stole plays and used it against teams, especially until they were caught....TWICE. There is no sugar coating that.

The thing that everyone seems to forget is how brutal football was in the 70s. You had some great teams on the top (Raiders, Dolphins, Cowboys) that made life very difficult. But, the truth is that it was a VIOLENT game.

Tom Brady is only able to do this now (even as he declines) because no one can touch him. You cannot escape the fact that the rules changes have significantly prolonged players careers and allowed this to happen. It's almost two hand touch out there at times.

I get the free agency angle, but when you have good coaching and a guy that can stand back there all day without fear of a pass rush, well then you have a massive advantage.

I think the bigger surprise is that more teams haven't tried to emulate all the bending of the rules that the Pats do. I watch them closely and they are constantly bumping, tugging, nudging WRs to disrupt them. It's all so subtle...and never gets called. Yet it impacts plays.

Their Oline constantly is grabbing Dlineman...but they are grabbing INSIDE the shoulder pads and holding. They are well coached to effectively cheat and get away with it. They do it so often that they know that Refs can't call it ever play and so it becomes acceptable.

How about the pick plays that the refs simply have accepted over the last 5 years? NE started that and now live off of it.

BB strains for every little advantage to maximize his chances of winning. He's cheating alright but doing it in a very subtle way and other teams simple haven't matched him.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:31 am 
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Kodiak wrote:
Hard to give a shit when the two best teams in the NFL - PIT and NO - were both fucked outta here by the refs.


Pittsburgh was NOT one of the 2 best teams in town, sorry. Should have been Chiefs vs Saints.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:48 am 
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I'm glad the Pats won 6. Maybe it'll light the fire under some asses within the organization because we are on the trajectory to not winning another meaningful thing for quite some time.

The whole Pats cheating thing just makes us look like we have sour grapes. The reality is with the amount of talent we have, we should have another ring or two. We just rely too heavily on talent alone and don't focus on the details like the Pats. When said talent gets shut down, it's curtains for us.

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:19 am 
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Nick79 wrote:
Will-the-Shake wrote:
No doubt the ‘78 Steelers were a much sexier team with all those Hall-of-Famers, but before you run around saying any team from the 70s would have beaten the Patriots tonight, you might want to check the weight of the offensive and defensive lines for teams then and now.

When comparing GOAT you don't consider how the actual players would perform against each other if they where magically brought to a field together now. You only consider what they did in their own time.


I don’t disagree, Nick. You can only play in your own era. My response was simply to the post that if they were on the field together now 1978 would “beat the shit out” of 2018.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:26 am 
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Will-the-Shake wrote:
Nick79 wrote:
Will-the-Shake wrote:
No doubt the ‘78 Steelers were a much sexier team with all those Hall-of-Famers, but before you run around saying any team from the 70s would have beaten the Patriots tonight, you might want to check the weight of the offensive and defensive lines for teams then and now.

When comparing GOAT you don't consider how the actual players would perform against each other if they where magically brought to a field together now. You only consider what they did in their own time.


I don’t disagree, Nick. You can only play in your own era. My response was simply to the post that if they were on the field together now 1978 would “beat the shit out” of 2018.

I guess i meant they would physically beat the shit out of Brady, while the team would beat the Patriots pretty easily.


Last edited by JaySteel72 on Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:35 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:27 am 
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StillerInCT wrote:
I'm glad the Pats won 6. Maybe it'll light the fire under some asses within the organization because we are on the trajectory to not winning another meaningful thing for quite some time.

The whole Pats cheating thing just makes us look like we have sour grapes. The reality is with the amount of talent we have, we should have another ring or two. We just rely too heavily on talent alone and don't focus on the details like the Pats. When said talent gets shut down, it's curtains for us.


Combine that with consistently losing a few games each season to bottom-feeders and it's no wonder that the Steelers struggle to make the Divisional Round of the playoffs despite having several HoF level players. The Steelers' arrogant, nonchalant approach all but guarantees they won't win anything significant anytime soon. And since Rooney is apparently fine with a historic collapse and a missed playoff berth, it could be a long time before things turn around. Teams like the Jets and Chiefs haven't won anything for 50 years, even longer for teams like the Lions or the Browns. The Steelers could be facing that type of precipice.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:32 am 
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Jeemie wrote:
They got 6 in half the time, in an era where supposedly there should be no dynasties.

You can marshal any argument you want...it’ll fall on deaf ears.

So you’re doing it to make yourselves feel better...that’s all.

Well, my thing with their 6 is two of those are a complete joke. If it werent for some of the worst coaching decisions in the history of sports they would still only have 4. Especially the Seattle game. It taints their dynasty for me. But you are correct, it will all fall on deaf ears. Nobody will ever mention those things again when bringing up the 2000s Patriots.


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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:07 am 
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franco32 wrote:
Look, there is no doubt the Pats stole plays and used it against teams, especially until they were caught....TWICE. There is no sugar coating that.

The thing that everyone seems to forget is how brutal football was in the 70s. You had some great teams on the top (Raiders, Dolphins, Cowboys) that made life very difficult. But, the truth is that it was a VIOLENT game.

Tom Brady is only able to do this now (even as he declines) because no one can touch him. You cannot escape the fact that the rules changes have significantly prolonged players careers and allowed this to happen. It's almost two hand touch out there at times.

I get the free agency angle, but when you have good coaching and a guy that can stand back there all day without fear of a pass rush, well then you have a massive advantage.

I think the bigger surprise is that more teams haven't tried to emulate all the bending of the rules that the Pats do. I watch them closely and they are constantly bumping, tugging, nudging WRs to disrupt them. It's all so subtle...and never gets called. Yet it impacts plays.

Their Oline constantly is grabbing Dlineman...but they are grabbing INSIDE the shoulder pads and holding. They are well coached to effectively cheat and get away with it. They do it so often that they know that Refs can't call it ever play and so it becomes acceptable.

How about the pick plays that the refs simply have accepted over the last 5 years? NE started that and now live off of it.

BB strains for every little advantage to maximize his chances of winning. He's cheating alright but doing it in a very subtle way and other teams simple haven't matched him.


Yes, BB used methods all coaches had used to steal signals, but to un-level the playing field BB used video to film and use in games and later on, where it was outlawed by the letters the NFL sent (a few times), BB said he mis-interpret the rule, no he didn't he was simply arrogant about it. Cowher re-affirmed this, we were all trying to get an advantage, but he did it with video. Cowher absolved BB because he doesn't want to be given a label as a hater/stigma and lose his cushy CBS gig.

That's the one thing Cowher lost respect from me. He's crossed over to protecting his meal ticket and is complicit in saying it had no real affect.

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 Post subject: Re: 6 > 6* = BS
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:16 am 
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StillerInCT wrote:
I'm glad the Pats won 6. Maybe it'll light the fire under some asses within the organization because we are on the trajectory to not winning another meaningful thing for quite some time.



I don't think so. I think Art2 is complacent and cares more about image than winning anything.


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