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 Post subject: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:46 pm 
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What are your thoughts a third through this season?
I was watching him get easily stone walled by the Cinci TE Iwuma which I would hope he would beat with his speed.
I thought guys like Ziggy Hood and Jarvis Jones at least were decent run stuffers but Bud seems to get lost in the wash.
Wish he would become a poor mans Clowney but at times he looks like Alonzo Jackson.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:41 pm 
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He's better than Jarvis Jones.

By a hair.

Maybe.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:55 pm 
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KC wrote:
He's better than Jarvis Jones.

By a hair.

Maybe.


Yeah, a pussy hair.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:56 pm 
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Bust. Artie Burns type disappointment. It’s strange because they have some great picks and acquisitions but these two guys are awful.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:47 pm 
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Is he as good as Zadarius Smith, his former teammate at Kentucky that went 3 rounds after him in the draft?


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:15 pm 
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You know it is funny, but I think Dupree is playing himself into a 2nd contract with the Steelers.

First, he may have that $9.2 million 5th year option for 2019 on the books but the Steelers will most likely sign him to a new deal for less than that. He won't make $9 million per season.

Some may say, Dupree is a bum, what has he done?

This season he has 19 tackles, 3 sacks, 4 passes defensed, 1 INT, 1 TD scored off of that INT, and 1 Forced Fumble. Sorry, but Jarvis Jones never performed like that, you guys can spin it all you want.

If the Steelers are going to pay Vince Williams an average of $6.2 million then resigning Dupree to $7, 7.5 million per season is easily possible.

Many of you may hate the idea but I think it is going to happen. My prediction? Bud probably ends the season with 8 sacks and the Steelers in the offseason give him a 5 year, $35 million deal and structure it in a way where that old $9.2 million 5th year option turns into a first year cap hit of some $4 million. So they free up $5 million, have Dupree under a new contract and hope for the best that he continues to improve.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:21 pm 
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7.5 million for some dong sacks and complete disappearing acts through not just games but parts of seasons? You might be right that the Steelers re-sign him, but he's not going to magically get better. He is who he is. Great straight line athlete. Very poor changing of direction. Horrid instincts. Even worse technique. Whipped by TEs.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:31 pm 
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I can certainly see them re-signing him (it would be very Steeler like) and most all of us here moaning about it. He’s a decidedly less awful player than Artie Burns at this point, but that’s not saying much.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:37 pm 
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I mostly agree Franco, but that Vince Williams contract just blew my mind at the time and to me it sets a precedent that they will easily sign Bud to a new contract. And also Jesse James too for that matter.

To me if I am the GM I move on from all 3 of those players and don't pay them but that is not what will happen. Instead we will see Vince Williams make $6.2 million per year, we will see Dupree make $7 million per year and Jesse James resigned and making between $4.5-5 million per year. That is mind boggling to me. That is why we can't have nice things, we overspend on average players and thus have less money to pursue free agents with real talent, that can be real impact players, starters.

Will, I agree on Burns. That TD this past game that he gave up was the last straw for me. Did he think he had safety help over the top?? :lol: He is who he is, a player with no instincts whatsoever. At least Bud will make some plays, Artie? No, that kid is a lost cause. If they give him a 2nd contract Colbert needs his head examined for CTE.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:01 pm 
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SP wrote:
Is he as good as Zadarius Smith, his former teammate at Kentucky that went 3 rounds after him in the draft?


Zadarius was the better player at UK. Smith was a JUCO transfer if I remember correctly. Bud flashed against bad competition, but Smith was the better overall player, just wondered if he'd be a fit in the 3-4. I remember PFF breaking down that essentially all of Dupree's sacks and pressures came against the worst of college football's offensive tackles. Against any sort of quality competition he was a ghost.

And yes, Smith went in the fourth round while we ran to the podium in the first to draft Alvin.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:49 am 
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franco32 wrote:
7.5 million for some dong sacks and complete disappearing acts through not just games but parts of seasons? You might be right that the Steelers re-sign him, but he's not going to magically get better. He is who he is. Great straight line athlete. Very poor changing of direction. Horrid instincts. Even worse technique. Whipped by TEs.

Agree and I think they will sign him too.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:29 am 
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My biggest fault with Bud is that his mind is stuck in the mud.
He has the physical tools, the measurables.

He spends too much time watching, watching the play unfold as others around him are reacting to the play.
Like there is too much thinking and thinking about his responsibilities.

He needs to do a much better job of cutting loose and getting after the QB.
He is too big and too fast to be stoned play after play.

I think coaching is also a big part of the reason he is not the player he should be.
Forget getting to the QB.......
How many times have we seen him do something entirely different in approaching the pass rush?
Spin, dip, rip, insane bull rush to dump his guy in the lap of the QB.
Its alot of the same.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:35 am 
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Great post Scunge. Best laugh of the day but all too true.

Scunge wrote:
I mostly agree Franco, but that Vince Williams contract just blew my mind at the time and to me it sets a precedent that they will easily sign Bud to a new contract. And also Jesse James too for that matter.

To me if I am the GM I move on from all 3 of those players and don't pay them but that is not what will happen. Instead we will see Vince Williams make $6.2 million per year, we will see Dupree make $7 million per year and Jesse James resigned and making between $4.5-5 million per year. That is mind boggling to me. That is why we can't have nice things, we overspend on average players and thus have less money to pursue free agents with real talent, that can be real impact players, starters.

Will, I agree on Burns. That TD this past game that he gave up was the last straw for me. Did he think he had safety help over the top?? :lol: He is who he is, a player with no instincts whatsoever. At least Bud will make some plays, Artie? No, that kid is a lost cause. If they give him a 2nd contract Colbert needs his head examined for CTE.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:06 am 
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Joey Porter needs to move on with his life's work. He's developed absolutely nobody at OLB.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:28 am 
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StillerInCT wrote:
Mike Tomlin needs to move on with his life's work. He's developed absolutely nobody at OLB.

Anybody still wonder why The Legendary Steeler James Harrison went full on insubordinate while being forced to stand on the sidelines and watch this shit show, knowing he would turn it back into a position of strength and would have been THE difference this defense needed :?:

then Dupy started running his ignorant millennial mouth and JPeezy and Mikey T kept siding with this jackass...

...and y'all left to wonder why we can't get outta our own way...

:roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:53 am 
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Steeledge wrote:
StillerInCT wrote:
Mike Tomlin needs to move on with his life's work. He's developed absolutely nobody at OLB.

Anybody still wonder why The Legendary Steeler James Harrison went full on insubordinate while being forced to stand on the sidelines and watch this shit show, knowing he would turn it back into a position of strength and would have been THE difference this defense needed :?:

then Dupy started running his ignorant millennial mouth and JPeezy and Mikey T kept siding with this jackass...

...and y'all left to wonder why we can't get outta our own way...

:roll:


The thing about about that situation that made it all acceptable to me was #92 getting to start in the super bowl a couple of weeks after his old team was eliminated after giving up 45 points to the vaunted Jaguar offense (yes 1 pick 6 in there). He who laughs last laughs best :D Cluster fuck of historical proportions.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:59 am 
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Enjoy the bye week boys 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 1:36 pm 
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Stosh-67 wrote:
My biggest fault with Bud is that his mind is stuck in the mud.
He has the physical tools, the measurables.

He spends too much time watching, watching the play unfold as others around him are reacting to the play.
Like there is too much thinking and thinking about his responsibilities.

He needs to do a much better job of cutting loose and getting after the QB.
He is too big and too fast to be stoned play after play.

I think coaching is also a big part of the reason he is not the player he should be.
Forget getting to the QB.......
How many times have we seen him do something entirely different in approaching the pass rush?
Spin, dip, rip, insane bull rush to dump his guy in the lap of the QB.
Its alot of the same.

This ^
I've been saying it for a few years too. It's like Bud can practice his pass rush in a simple/predictable setting (against a dummy) and look great, but the minute real bullets fly and he has to adjust to any variables (like real football) he's useless. Bud has elite physical tools, but a 10 cent head. He's probably a nice guy too, but he's just not mentally equipped to be as effective (in real football settings) as his tools would allow him. I'm not sure he'll ever be more than an average player, at best.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 1:49 pm 
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They should’ve signed Kevin Greene as OLB coach when they had the chance. Porter is an idiot.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 2:35 pm 
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Just curious as to the number of threads titled "Bud Dupree." Seems every week there's another. I don't even think Jervis or Cowher to the ... had as many.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 3:55 pm 
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franco32 wrote:
7.5 million for some dong sacks and complete disappearing acts through not just games but parts of seasons? You might be right that the Steelers re-sign him, but he's not going to magically get better. He is who he is. Great straight line athlete. Very poor changing of direction. Horrid instincts. Even worse technique. Whipped by TEs.

What dong sacks? And he's been pretty good vs the run, not the worst in coverage. I agree with Scunge that I fully expect him to be re-signed in that $7M range.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:28 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
You know it is funny, but I think Dupree is playing himself into a 2nd contract with the Steelers.

First, he may have that $9.2 million 5th year option for 2019 on the books but the Steelers will most likely sign him to a new deal for less than that. He won't make $9 million per season.

Some may say, Dupree is a bum, what has he done?

This season he has 19 tackles, 3 sacks, 4 passes defensed, 1 INT, 1 TD scored off of that INT, and 1 Forced Fumble. Sorry, but Jarvis Jones never performed like that, you guys can spin it all you want.

If the Steelers are going to pay Vince Williams an average of $6.2 million then resigning Dupree to $7, 7.5 million per season is easily possible.

Many of you may hate the idea but I think it is going to happen. My prediction? Bud probably ends the season with 8 sacks and the Steelers in the offseason give him a 5 year, $35 million deal and structure it in a way where that old $9.2 million 5th year option turns into a first year cap hit of some $4 million. So they free up $5 million, have Dupree under a new contract and hope for the best that he continues to improve.


Thanks for taking the time Scunge. I admit that I may have an unrealistic expectation of him being 1st round. I cant remember if the sacks are quality sacks or did he feast when someone else did 90% of the dirty work?

Anyways...points taken


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:55 pm 
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I guess B2B and me are the only two in Bud's corner, so to speak.

All I know is that the two OLBs are playing better this season. The switching of sides has worked, and they have even been flipping them at times to where I have seen Dupree rushing from his old spot at LOLB.

The first 6 games and our two starting OLBs have combined for 9 sacks. That is on pace for 24 sacks. The combo of Harrison/Woodley had 27.5 sacks in 2008 and 23.5 sacks in 2009. That was their two best seasons together, that is the 'gold standard' what all of you crave, right? Dupree/Watt are challenging that type of production. So what the hell are people complaining about? When you look at it from that perspective, aren't some of you being silly? What if Watt and Bud end the season with 28 sacks, set a new record for total combined sacks at OLB? Will you guys just accuse them of getting nothing more than Dong sacks?

The whole thing about Dong sacks is ridiculous to me and always has been. This past game, Stephon Tuitt had 1 sack, 2 QB hits and basically was responsible for Hargrave's sack. He got so much pressure that he practically forced Dalton right into Hargrave waiting arms. Pass rushing does not happen in a vacuum, it is nuanced and always has been and even Deebo and Woodley back in the day were not the dominant pass rushers that many think they were, that many remember that they were. I made a post where I showed how hot and cold they were as pass rushers, how they would have 7 or 8 game where they had no sacks, how they would get sacks in bunches, how one would be cold and the other would be hot. Many seem to think that is not the case, but you are wrong.

What we really need is for a better 3rd OLB in the rotation, Chickillo is really bad and I don't think he even makes the team elsewhere in the NFL. I am hoping that Ola Adeniyi is able to come off IR and dislodge Chick as that 3rd OLB, he has legitimate pass rush ability and appeared to be a capable special teams player. Adeniyi could make Watt and Dupree even better and keep them fresh and rested down the stretch.

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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:56 pm 
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Stosh-67 wrote:
My biggest fault with Bud is that his mind is stuck in the mud.
He has the physical tools, the measurables.

He spends too much time watching, watching the play unfold as others around him are reacting to the play.
Like there is too much thinking and thinking about his responsibilities.

He needs to do a much better job of cutting loose and getting after the QB.
He is too big and too fast to be stoned play after play.

I think coaching is also a big part of the reason he is not the player he should be.
Forget getting to the QB.......
How many times have we seen him do something entirely different in approaching the pass rush?
Spin, dip, rip, insane bull rush to dump his guy in the lap of the QB.
Its alot of the same.


I was reading some of the intel coming out of college and the evaluation had him struggling when needing to be cerebral. I thought that was the knock on Timmons also and the dot.


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 Post subject: Re: Bud Dupree
PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:59 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
I guess B2B and me are the only two in Bud's corner, so to speak.

All I know is that the two OLBs are playing better this season. The switching of sides has worked, and they have even been flipping them at times to where I have seen Dupree rushing from his old spot at LOLB.

The first 6 games and our two starting OLBs have combined for 9 sacks. That is on pace for 24 sacks. The combo of Harrison/Woodley had 27.5 sacks in 2008 and 23.5 sacks in 2009. That was their two best seasons together, that is the 'gold standard' what all of you crave, right? Dupree/Watt are challenging that type of production. So what the hell are people complaining about? When you look at it from that perspective, aren't some of you being silly? What if Watt and Bud end the season with 28 sacks, set a new record for total combined sacks at OLB? Will you guys just accuse them of getting nothing more than Dong sacks?

The whole thing about Dong sacks is ridiculous to me and always has been. This past game, Stephon Tuitt had 1 sack, 2 QB hits and basically was responsible for Hargrave's sack. He got so much pressure that he practically forced Dalton right into Hargrave waiting arms. Pass rushing does not happen in a vacuum, it is nuanced and always has been and even Deebo and Woodley back in the day were not the dominant pass rushers that many think they were, that many remember that they were. I made a post where I showed how hot and cold they were as pass rushers, how they would have 7 or 8 game where they had no sacks, how they would get sacks in bunches, how one would be cold and the other would be hot. Many seem to think that is not the case, but you are wrong.

What we really need is for a better 3rd OLB in the rotation, Chickillo is really bad and I don't think he even makes the team elsewhere in the NFL. I am hoping that Ola Adeniyi is able to come off IR and dislodge Chick as that 3rd OLB, he has legitimate pass rush ability and appeared to be a capable special teams player. Adeniyi could make Watt and Dupree even better and keep them fresh and rested down the stretch.


great stuff...I see what I see..... but to your point the end generated result is a contribution of things and not so clear cut as I may want to point out.


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