It is currently Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:26 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 52 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:36 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:23 pm
Posts: 3260
Had a great day with 21 runs for 110 yards, 2 TDS, and 4 catches for 75. 185 yds from scrimmage. Granted Atlanta defense not good.
Ridley (who I wanted to see) did little.

Conner looks Rough and ready, and learning on the job.

AB’s ego also had a great game with 101 yards and 2 TD.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:01 am
Posts: 11317
I still don't have much of a read running the ball because the first 4 games played out so strangely....but receiving he is kind of special.

Overall, I think he is a much better value than Bell. I don't think there's much drop-off in contribution, although Bell might give us a bit more in the running game (Conner is faster and more decisive, hard to say if Bell would really be more effective).

And Conner's blocking has been pretty decent, which was the big knock. 1-2 more games like today and Bell never wears he Black&Gold again.

_________________
------------------------------------------------------


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:33 pm
Posts: 16267
Conner played big boy football today. He was outstanding and inspired.

If I had known that it was cancer awareness day in the NFL, I would have bet on a huge day for Conner.

_________________
Suwanee88 wrote:
But it’s your fault that you are kind of a stubborn jagoff that would argue with a fence post


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:53 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:23 pm
Posts: 3260
Also Conner used his blocks and even showed some vision this game.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1704
Stallworth16 wrote:
Also Conner used his blocks and even showed some vision this game.


Last game he had nowhere to go and even less to see.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:23 pm
Posts: 3260
stillthere wrote:
Stallworth16 wrote:
Also Conner used his blocks and even showed some vision this game.


Last game he had nowhere to go and even less to see.

Certainly Rats have a better run D than Atlanta.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 5:16 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2014 2:17 pm
Posts: 1381
Connor is one of the most impressive players on this football team and I have never been anything other than high on him since he got here. If it isnt another homerun pick on offense, its at least a triple for Colbert. He is more than doing his part minimizing the impact of losing Bell and we are damn lucky to have him.

_________________
Zeke5123 wrote:
if I flip a coin 100 times and it always comes up heads, I might change my estimation on whether it is a fair coin.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:18 pm
Posts: 4672
Location: Sunny Delaware (but the murdery part)
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Conner played big boy football today. He was outstanding and inspired.

If I had known that it was cancer awareness day in the NFL, I would have bet on a huge day for Conner.


In a positive note for us, it's actually cancer awareness month now, so we've got at least three more weeks of it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:13 pm
Posts: 3979
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Conner played big boy football today. He was outstanding and inspired.

If I had known that it was cancer awareness day in the NFL, I would have bet on a huge day for Conner.


He ran so hard today. I can't think of one play where he went down on first contact.

_________________
SteelThrillsseeker wrote:
Dad showed up after work and according to her the entire hospital hears my dad yell you are not naming our son Hoss.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 11:10 am
Posts: 1152
My bet is that he develops another subtle skill in the next game or two. He will start trusting his skills in the NFL shortly and begin to work on something additional to give him an edge. It might be the pause like Bell, or something in the passing game, or maybe he will continue to work on his nasty spin move. Seems that thing is getting faster.
Still think he needs to work on his pause for the blockers, but that may be why he is considered more decisive than Bell and gets more YAC than Bell.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:56 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:23 pm
Posts: 3260
Conner highlights vs Falcons. NFL films so not embedded.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgAF061_zyQ


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:18 pm
Posts: 10472
TB wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Conner played big boy football today. He was outstanding and inspired.

If I had known that it was cancer awareness day in the NFL, I would have bet on a huge day for Conner.


He ran so hard today. I can't think of one play where he went down on first contact.

yes; dude was in beast mode. and breaking tackle after tackle.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 7:57 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 9:34 pm
Posts: 23253
I think it's two simple things:

1) He's feeling more confident with each game (he is struggles in the past couple games notwithstanding)

2) Bell says he's coming back in a couple weeks, and Conner wants to make it difficult to sit him down.

_________________
“A set of several simple rules leads to complex, intelligent behavior. While a set of complex rules often leads to dumb and primitive behavior.”


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:45 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:47 am
Posts: 4238
I'm on board with Conner.

He's a stud receiving the football. Has not even had one bobble that I can remember... fantastic hands, solid as a rock.

18.8 Y/R long of 29

30 yd run

Conner gives us splash plays that Bell cannot do. I do not want to see that splash removed from the offense.

I do not believe we would have scored more points with Molasses at RB today and we might not have scored as many.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:11 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:37 pm
Posts: 205
LakecrestSteeler wrote:
My bet is that he develops another subtle skill in the next game or two. He will start trusting his skills in the NFL shortly and begin to work on something additional to give him an edge. It might be the pause like Bell, or something in the passing game, or maybe he will continue to work on his nasty spin move. Seems that thing is getting faster.
Still think he needs to work on his pause for the blockers, but that may be why he is considered more decisive than Bell and gets more YAC than Bell.

No. And no. His short body of work has more than proven that he is ready, willing, and able to carry the load left behind by Bell with NO DROPOFF. He doesn't need to develop "subtle skills". He just needs to keep doing EXACTLY what he is doing when the Steelers don't spot their opponent 2-3 touchdown leads.

I've been saying this for 5 weeks now, we are no better with Bell in the backfield. There is no dropoff. JC is every bit as productive as Bell ever was. He should be getting Bell's game checks while Bell is out.

The only thing he needs to do is protect the ball better when he's fighting for extra yards. Maybe give up that extra couple yards at the end of the run and secure the ball. At some point, his trying to eek out a few more yards or break one more tackle might cost us. Fortunately, to this point it hasn't.

_________________
You're never as good as you think you are, or as bad as they say you are.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:27 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:14 pm
Posts: 1897
To Havoc's point, yeah, I think Bell supporters will say that the offense would be better and that Bell would do better but I personally don't think so. I have been critical of the O-line this season. The holes have not really been there and there have been injuries to blame too perhaps for that. Also, I hate to say it but Rosie Nix hasn't been blocking as well as he normally does. That is hard for me to say because I love me some Rosie Nix.

So for people to say oh, Bell would do what Conner has been doing, I am not so sure. Conner has been breaking tackles, he has been more physical, I don't think Bell would have gotten the same yards.

I also think that Conner's speed and quickness after the tuck is better than Bell. Ben has talked about this with Conner. Conner catches the ball and he does not mess around, he tucks it and is rumbling along, running forward. With Bell you see him so often catch the ball, come to a stop, run sideways trying to elude a tackler and not really picking up the yardage that Conner has been doing these 5 games.

The splash plays, people might say what the hell are you talking about Scunge, what are you talking about Havoc?

Bell played in 15 games last season and had 2 runs over 20+ yards. James Conner in just 5 games has 3 runs over 20+ yards.

Bell played in 15 games last season and had 5 catches over 20+ yards. James Conner in just 5 games has 3 catches over 20+ yards.

Bell in 15 games last season had a combined 7 plays over 20+ yards, Conner in just 5 games has 6 plays over 20+ yards.

If Bell did not come back and Conner played all season, might Conner end up with 20 plays over 20+ yards? With Conner I believe that he is so close to ripping off a 50 yard run or catch for a TD, with Bell I have no such confidence.

To Lakecrest's point, yeah, I agree that Conner needs to develop subtle skills. Remember Bell was not the same player he was as a rookie. His jump from year one as a starter to year two was significant. Conner in the same position will likely have the same sort of significant jump as a runner. Some RBs have an innate ability but some runners also learn as they go and some it is a combination of the two.

_________________
#greendot51


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:51 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:37 pm
Posts: 205
Scunge wrote:
To Havoc's point, yeah, I think Bell supporters will say that the offense would be better and that Bell would do better but I personally don't think so. I have been critical of the O-line this season. The holes have not really been there and there have been injuries to blame too perhaps for that. Also, I hate to say it but Rosie Nix hasn't been blocking as well as he normally does. That is hard for me to say because I love me some Rosie Nix.

So for people to say oh, Bell would do what Conner has been doing, I am not so sure. Conner has been breaking tackles, he has been more physical, I don't think Bell would have gotten the same yards.

I also think that Conner's speed and quickness after the tuck is better than Bell. Ben has talked about this with Conner. Conner catches the ball and he does not mess around, he tucks it and is rumbling along, running forward. With Bell you see him so often catch the ball, come to a stop, run sideways trying to elude a tackler and not really picking up the yardage that Conner has been doing these 5 games.

The splash plays, people might say what the hell are you talking about Scunge, what are you talking about Havoc?

Bell played in 15 games last season and had 2 runs over 20+ yards. James Conner in just 5 games has 3 runs over 20+ yards.

Bell played in 15 games last season and had 5 catches over 20+ yards. James Conner in just 5 games has 3 catches over 20+ yards.

Bell in 15 games last season had a combined 7 plays over 20+ yards, Conner in just 5 games has 6 plays over 20+ yards.

If Bell did not come back and Conner played all season, might Conner end up with 20 plays over 20+ yards? With Conner I believe that he is so close to ripping off a 50 yard run or catch for a TD, with Bell I have no such confidence.

To Lakecrest's point, yeah, I agree that Conner needs to develop subtle skills. Remember Bell was not the same player he was as a rookie. His jump from year one as a starter to year two was significant. Conner in the same position will likely have the same sort of significant jump as a runner. Some RBs have an innate ability but some runners also learn as they go and some it is a combination of the two.

You are spot on with your analysis of JC and pointing out that he is simply a more productive back than Bell was. I've been banging that drum since week 1.

But let's clarify "developing subtle skills". My bone of contention with Lakecrest is when he says JC should develop into a Bell clone by mimicking his pause or developing something in the passing game. First, he is a downhill runner. He should in no way change the type of running style at this level just because it works for another back. To even suggest that is ludicrous. Second, WHAT ELSE SHOULD HE DO IN THE PASSING GAME?????? My God, leave him alone. He's already out producing Bell.

Now, if by "subtle development" you mean just get better at his craft in general, then I'm right there with you. He needs better ball security. He can work on blocking. He can develop better timing and trust with his O line. That would make him more complete and even more dangerous.

_________________
You're never as good as you think you are, or as bad as they say you are.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 6:10 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 11:10 am
Posts: 1152
Definitely to work on his craft and not to become a Bell clone. I think I have seen him bust through a play or two when he could have waited for a block. It might go against his style to wait or pause. Maybe he will need to get further in the backfield to allow for timing. When you watch the replays with him, I believe he has incredible vision. He is seeing everything and it just so happens he has been shot out of a cannon too. To Scunge’s point he is on the cusp of busting some big runs from rushing or passing...they are coming.

We won today with no focus on the TE. We have 3 groups that we can really shift the offense towards. Great receivers, great feature back and great TE group (when healthy); so this offense can do whatever the hell it wants. Only thing stopping it will be coaching, injuries, or messing with Bell.

Connor may have to deal with his second cancer when Bell gets back.

I just can’t imagine starting Bell over JC if we are on a hot streak, why waste the money when we need stars on D.

Don’t forget the OK State example. Thurman Thomas was one fine back coming out of college and went on to have an amazing NFL career for Buffalo...4 Superbowls. His Cowboy back-up was????? Barry Sanders.

Maybe Bell is Thomas


Last edited by LakecrestSteeler on Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:39 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 9:18 pm
Posts: 11315
Havoc wrote:
I'm on board with Conner.

He's a stud receiving the football. Has not even had one bobble that I can remember... fantastic hands, solid as a rock.

18.8 Y/R long of 29

30 yd run

Conner gives us splash plays that Bell cannot do. I do not want to see that splash removed from the offense.

I do not believe we would have scored more points with Molasses at RB today and we might not have scored as many.


Conner had the massive, game altering fumble in week one.

Probably tired at the time from being overworked in his first game, but he coughed it up inside his own 20 yard line and one play later, our 14 point lead was 7.

I believe he did have a bobble yesterday (perhaps it was someone else?) that ended up going out of bounds. I'm pretty sure it was Conner and I was scared shitless he was going to fumble the ball through the endzone for a touchback.

If you mean no bobbles as a receiver, then I apologize.

I have to admit, Conner has been better than expected but I think we forget how good Bell is.

There's a reason he's considered among the best backs in the NFL. I wish he was more of a threat to take it to the house on any given play, but Bell is special.

_________________
86n96 wrote:
Been checked to it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:45 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:18 pm
Posts: 10472
another thought;; if im on defense id much rather tackle bell all game then Connor! Connor was laying some blows on the de yesterday!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:50 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:14 pm
Posts: 1897
KC, I have been pointing this out all offseason, Leveon Bell has fumbled 7 times in his last 24 regular season games.

So, was James Conner never supposed to fumble? Why? If you are going to have a bell cow back, feed him the ball, give him so many touches, catches and carries, then yeah, fumbles are going to be part and parcel of that position.

Of those 7 fumbles Bell had in his last 24 games, 3 were for loss, meaning the defense recovered, 2 of them went out of bounds and 2 were recovered by the offense.

So, Conner has 2 fumbles this season, one for a loss and one went out of bounds. Many might try and blow it out of proportion but Conner isn't doing anything that Bell hasn't done. The standard is the standard right?

Did the Rams bench Gurley when he fumbled 5 times last season. Did Arizona bench Johnson when he fumbled 5 times in 2016?

_________________
#greendot51


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:30 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2015 11:10 am
Posts: 1152
That near fumble was another great play by the DB. If you watch it in slow motion, I think JC has awareness of where everyone is on the field. The DB whiffs on JC because he lifts his arm like a matador to prevent a fumble from a smashed helmet to forearm most likely, then he puts his arm down for more ball security and the DB because of his whiff does this back hand flail and miraculously strikes the ball. That man should have been out of the equation! JC will enter that into the vault.

I think JC saw everything!

His slo-mo plays are actually quite poetic. There is a ton to take in watching him in slo-mo. His eyes are darting, he has classic moves, high knees, Teflon legs, plotting his moves...the kid might be special!

KC is comparing JC to Bell now which is fair, I am comparing him to Bell his first year. JC is impressive! I think NFL films will be doing features on him, because he is emotive as hell when he is running the rock, and almost old school.

Tomlin, Colbert and Rooney will be earning their money and getting greys when it comes to the decision of Bell and JC. I think you go with the long term play...keep JC and cut Bell and all his garbage.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:00 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2014 12:48 pm
Posts: 1440
LakecrestSteeler wrote:
That near fumble was another great play by the DB. If you watch it in slow motion, I think JC has awareness of where everyone is on the field. The DB whiffs on JC because he lifts his arm like a matador to prevent a fumble from a smashed helmet to forearm most likely, then he puts his arm down for more ball security and the DB because of his whiff does this back hand flail and miraculously strikes the ball. That man should have been out of the equation! JC will enter that into the vault.

I think JC saw everything!

His slo-mo plays are actually quite poetic. There is a ton to take in watching him in slo-mo. His eyes are darting, he has classic moves, high knees, Teflon legs, plotting his moves...the kid might be special!

KC is comparing JC to Bell now which is fair, I am comparing him to Bell his first year. JC is impressive! I think NFL films will be doing features on him, because he is emotive as hell when he is running the rock, and almost old school.

Tomlin, Colbert and Rooney will be earning their money and getting greys when it comes to the decision of Bell and JC. I think you go with the long term play...keep JC and cut Bell and all his garbage.

I saw the same thing yesterday, Lake. Was a great play by the DB to slap his arm backwards on his way by and hit the ball out.

My biggest hope is that we can get Philly to give us one of their 2019 2nd rounders for Bell in the next few week, as I think that's our best chance at trading him.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:48 am
Posts: 900
Scunge wrote:
KC, I have been pointing this out all offseason, Leveon Bell has fumbled 7 times in his last 24 regular season games.

So, was James Conner never supposed to fumble? Why? If you are going to have a bell cow back, feed him the ball, give him so many touches, catches and carries, then yeah, fumbles are going to be part and parcel of that position.

Of those 7 fumbles Bell had in his last 24 games, 3 were for loss, meaning the defense recovered, 2 of them went out of bounds and 2 were recovered by the offense.

So, Conner has 2 fumbles this season, one for a loss and one went out of bounds. Many might try and blow it out of proportion but Conner isn't doing anything that Bell hasn't done. The standard is the standard right?

Did the Rams bench Gurley when he fumbled 5 times last season. Did Arizona bench Johnson when he fumbled 5 times in 2016?


Who recommended a benching?

Also, not all fumbles are equal. I don't remember a bell fumble directly changing the outcome of a game as Conner's against the browns. In turtle mode, objective #1: do not fumble.

That said, he seems to have learned from it and immediately you saw 2 arms on ball in traffic. I'm not declaring Conner incompetent because of the fumble, but 3-2 and we are looking to possibly share division lead with Bungs this week. It was costly.

Conner was a man possessed yesterday. Great effort. As B2B says, him and Bell would make one hell of a combo.

People can deny it, but Bell is playing for the steelers this year. All parties will probably stay quiet to cool the emotions of the past few weeks. Having these 2 backs healthy is this team's best chances for a run this year.

It's an uphill battle for a playoff spot right now.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2014 11:54 pm
Posts: 2219
KC wrote:
Havoc wrote:
I'm on board with Conner.

He's a stud receiving the football. Has not even had one bobble that I can remember... fantastic hands, solid as a rock.

18.8 Y/R long of 29

30 yd run

Conner gives us splash plays that Bell cannot do. I do not want to see that splash removed from the offense.

I do not believe we would have scored more points with Molasses at RB today and we might not have scored as many.


Conner had the massive, game altering fumble in week one.

Probably tired at the time from being overworked in his first game, but he coughed it up inside his own 20 yard line and one play later, our 14 point lead was 7.

I believe he did have a bobble yesterday (perhaps it was someone else?) that ended up going out of bounds. I'm pretty sure it was Conner and I was scared shitless he was going to fumble the ball through the endzone for a touchback.

If you mean no bobbles as a receiver, then I apologize.

I have to admit, Conner has been better than expected but I think we forget how good Bell is.

There's a reason he's considered among the best backs in the NFL. I wish he was more of a threat to take it to the house on any given play, but Bell is special.


I'm with KC on this one...This thread popped up because JC had a big game. What about three out of five games this year?

JC's vision is below average. Maybe that will improve with time, but for now JC is a good but not great back.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:01 am
Posts: 11317
Zeke5123 wrote:
JC's vision is below average. Maybe that will improve with time, but for now JC is a good but not great back.


He's been a standout receiving.

I'm still undecided on him as a runner. I agree with what you said, but the first 4 games unfolded strangely. He's run well in 2 of the 3 games we got early leads in, so I think the jury is still out.

He and Bell would be a great 1-2 punch, but that will probably never happen.

_________________
------------------------------------------------------


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2014 12:48 pm
Posts: 1440
Zeke5123 wrote:
KC wrote:
Havoc wrote:
I'm on board with Conner.

He's a stud receiving the football. Has not even had one bobble that I can remember... fantastic hands, solid as a rock.

18.8 Y/R long of 29

30 yd run

Conner gives us splash plays that Bell cannot do. I do not want to see that splash removed from the offense.

I do not believe we would have scored more points with Molasses at RB today and we might not have scored as many.


Conner had the massive, game altering fumble in week one.

Probably tired at the time from being overworked in his first game, but he coughed it up inside his own 20 yard line and one play later, our 14 point lead was 7.

I believe he did have a bobble yesterday (perhaps it was someone else?) that ended up going out of bounds. I'm pretty sure it was Conner and I was scared shitless he was going to fumble the ball through the endzone for a touchback.

If you mean no bobbles as a receiver, then I apologize.

I have to admit, Conner has been better than expected but I think we forget how good Bell is.

There's a reason he's considered among the best backs in the NFL. I wish he was more of a threat to take it to the house on any given play, but Bell is special.


I'm with KC on this one...This thread popped up because JC had a big game. What about three out of five games this year?

JC's vision is below average. Maybe that will improve with time, but for now JC is a good but not great back.

I disagree about his lack of production in 3 of the 5 games this year. In those 3 games he touched the ball 12, 20 and 13 times. In the 2 games he's been Bell's equal, he's touched it 36 and 25 times...just like Bell did last year whenever he had a big game. If the game unfolds in a way he can get a lot of touches (Bell average something like 35 touches a game last year) then he's shown he can produce just as well as Bell, with more explosive plays to boot.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1704
LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Definitely to work on his craft and not to become a Bell clone. I think I have seen him bust through a play or two when he could have waited for a block. It might go against his style to wait or pause. Maybe he will need to get further in the backfield to allow for timing. When you watch the replays with him, I believe he has incredible vision. He is seeing everything and it just so happens he has been shot out of a cannon too. To Scunge’s point he is on the cusp of busting some big runs from rushing or passing...they are coming.

We won today with no focus on the TE. We have 3 groups that we can really shift the offense towards. Great receivers, great feature back and great TE group (when healthy); so this offense can do whatever the hell it wants. Only thing stopping it will be coaching, injuries, or messing with Bell.

Connor may have to deal with his second cancer when Bell gets back.

I just can’t imagine starting Bell over JC if we are on a hot streak, why waste the money when we need stars on D.

Don’t forget the OK State example. Thurman Thomas was one fine back coming out of college and went on to have an amazing NFL career for Buffalo...4 Superbowls. His Cowboy back-up was????? Barry Sanders.

Maybe Bell is Thomas


Sanders was a bit introverted coming out of HS and was told by OU (switzer) that he would start immediately but OSU told him that Thomas was the starter and that fit with what Barry wanted at the time better.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:07 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1704
ha ha

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:16 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1704
https://twitter.com/pff_steelers/status/1049362176664854529?s=21

Quote:
Most missed tackles forced as a runner and a receiver through the first 5 weeks this season:

James Conner - 32
Saquon Barkley - 27
Kareem Hunt - 26
Lynch, Gordon, McCaffrey - 23

@JamesConner_ is one hard man to bring down! #Steelers


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:12 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:22 am
Posts: 949
i think there's a fair point to be made about Conner's lack of vision, general lack of NFL polish as compared to Bell, etc.; the stuff the podcast crew has been (correctly) harping on for weeks

he strikes me as a guy who if granted the starting role is always going to impress one week and get completely stonewalled the next, at least as a rusher (though he's shown he can still contribute as a pass-catcher even in those games)
if you're looking for a consistent 4 ypc and 100-yard games, Bell is probably your guy

but in today's NFL i'd gladly trade that consistency for the big-play potential Conner gives you
our offense is completely dead in the water the other day without Conner's 'chunk plays'
not just the 30-yard run that's a near-impossibility for Bell at this point, but the 6-8 yard carries on first down, the conversion on the ridiculous 3rd-and-long screen call, etc.

he's so clearly the better option in short yardage situations that i think there's a wing and a prayer we continue to use him in that role, but the other stuff is essentially gone with Bell's return and we know it

_________________
"He's the slowest, best athlete I've ever seen in my life." - Vince Williams on Ben Roethlisberger

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1704
Chidi Iwuoma wrote:
but in today's NFL i'd gladly trade that consistency for the big-play potential Conner gives you
our offense is completely dead in the water the other day without Conner's 'chunk plays'
not just the 30-yard run that's a near-impossibility for Bell at this point, but the 6-8 yard carries on first down, the conversion on the ridiculous 3rd-and-long screen call, etc.


Add to that the leap over the line for the TD. I didn't think that was in his tool bag.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:30 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:14 pm
Posts: 1897
Bell's 2017 season, showing some of his worst yards per carry games.

10 carries 32 yards 3.20 avg
27 carries 87 yards, 3.22 avg
15 carries 47 yards, 3.13 avg
35 carries 134 yards, 3.83 avg
25 carries 76 yards, 3.04 avg
26 carries 80 yards, 3.08 avg
12 carries 46 yards, 3.83 avg
13 carries 48 yards, 3.69 avg

Bell's 2017 season, showing some of his worst yards per catch games.

3 catches for 15 yards, 5.0 avg
4 catches for 4 yards, 1.0 avg
10 catches for 46 yards, 4.6 avg
3 catches for 12 yards, 4.0 avg
2 catches for 5 yards, 2.5 avg
5 catches for 32 yards, 6.4 avg
9 catches for 57 yards, 6.33 avg
5 catches for 28 yards, 5.6 avg

Now that is 8 games showing him with a pretty awful yards per carry, and that is 8 games where he had equally awful yards per catch.

This narrative that somehow Bell has more dominant games, or is more even keeled than James Conner looks to be false to me.

Some of those games, yikes, 4 catches for 4 yards? A 1 yard average??

Conner is averaging 10.9 yards a catch, Bell averaged 7.7 yards per catch last season. Conner is averaging more than 3.2 yards per catch over Bell.

You look at the games last season against Detroit and Indy, they kept giving carries to Bell, did not abandon the run, and he still only averaged 3.04 yards, 3.08 yards. Don't tell me that Bell is so consistent from game to game, no, he is not. That same game against Detroit he had 2 catches for 5 yards, a 2.5 yard average.

In 2016 these are some of Bell's yards per carry games:

20 carries for 66 yards, 3.3 avg
21 carries for 81 yards, 3.86 avg
14 carries for 32 yards, 2.29 avg
17 carries for 57 yards, 3.35 avg

Those last 3 games I listed all came in a 3 week period, all losses, and yes, we fell behind, felt the need to abandon the run and pass more, how is that any different than what Conner was faced with in games 2-4 this season? Really no difference at all.

Look, I think Bell coming back will be good for the offense in that Conner can stay fresh and maintain his physical running style. If he were to play the rest of the season like he did against Atlanta he might find himself wore down at the end of the season. I am all for Bell coming in and playing some, I don't know if I just give him his starting job back.

I think it is dubious to think he is going to be able to step on the field and not be rusty and out of sync. Happened last season and now he has a much longer layoff working against him.

_________________
#greendot51


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:32 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:37 pm
Posts: 205
LakecrestSteeler wrote:
That near fumble was another great play by the DB. If you watch it in slow motion, I think JC has awareness of where everyone is on the field. The DB whiffs on JC because he lifts his arm like a matador to prevent a fumble from a smashed helmet to forearm most likely, then he puts his arm down for more ball security and the DB because of his whiff does this back hand flail and miraculously strikes the ball. That man should have been out of the equation! JC will enter that into the vault. .

Did I see a different play? JC had his helmet yanked forward by Riley right before Kazee takes a shot at it. JC had just stiff-armed Riley and was turned toward the sideline. He was beginning to turn back towards the endzone as the ball got hit. I credit the fumble more to the surprise of his helmet being yanked than anything.

_________________
You're never as good as you think you are, or as bad as they say you are.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:36 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 01, 2014 12:38 pm
Posts: 745
Scunge wrote:
Bell's 2017 season, showing some of his worst yards per carry games.

Look, I think Bell coming back will be good for the offense in that Conner can stay fresh and maintain his physical running style. If he were to play the rest of the season like he did against Atlanta he might find himself wore down at the end of the season. I am all for Bell coming in and playing some, I don't know if I just give him his starting job back.

I think it is dubious to think he is going to be able to step on the field and not be rusty and out of sync. Happened last season and now he has a much longer layoff working against him.


I think that it's almost guaranteed that Bell will come in rusty and out of sync. As you pointed out, it happened last year, and this year's holdout has been much longer. Judging from his wave runner video he doesn't look to be in great shape. Plus there's a new OC, so there are almost certainly new wrinkles (at least) the Bell will need to learn. Barring injury to Conner, I'd rather Bell not show up this year. Chances are he'd be more of a distraction and hindrance than a positive.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:51 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:37 pm
Posts: 205
W&M_Steeler wrote:
Scunge wrote:
Bell's 2017 season, showing some of his worst yards per carry games.

Look, I think Bell coming back will be good for the offense in that Conner can stay fresh and maintain his physical running style. If he were to play the rest of the season like he did against Atlanta he might find himself wore down at the end of the season. I am all for Bell coming in and playing some, I don't know if I just give him his starting job back.

I think it is dubious to think he is going to be able to step on the field and not be rusty and out of sync. Happened last season and now he has a much longer layoff working against him.


I think that it's almost guaranteed that Bell will come in rusty and out of sync. As you pointed out, it happened last year, and this year's holdout has been much longer. Judging from his wave runner video he doesn't look to be in great shape. Plus there's a new OC, so there are almost certainly new wrinkles (at least) the Bell will need to learn. Barring injury to Conner, I'd rather Bell not show up this year. Chances are he'd be more of a distraction and hindrance than a positive.

THIS

_________________
You're never as good as you think you are, or as bad as they say you are.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:52 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 9:18 pm
Posts: 11315
W&M_Steeler wrote:
Scunge wrote:
Bell's 2017 season, showing some of his worst yards per carry games.

Look, I think Bell coming back will be good for the offense in that Conner can stay fresh and maintain his physical running style. If he were to play the rest of the season like he did against Atlanta he might find himself wore down at the end of the season. I am all for Bell coming in and playing some, I don't know if I just give him his starting job back.

I think it is dubious to think he is going to be able to step on the field and not be rusty and out of sync. Happened last season and now he has a much longer layoff working against him.


I think that it's almost guaranteed that Bell will come in rusty and out of sync. As you pointed out, it happened last year, and this year's holdout has been much longer. Judging from his wave runner video he doesn't look to be in great shape. Plus there's a new OC, so there are almost certainly new wrinkles (at least) the Bell will need to learn. Barring injury to Conner, I'd rather Bell not show up this year. Chances are he'd be more of a distraction and hindrance than a positive.


Bell wants his workload limited.

He'll likely be James Conner's biggest fan (meaning: the more Conner plays, the less wear and tear on Bell's body.)

They will coexist just fine.

_________________
86n96 wrote:
Been checked to it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 6:43 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:11 pm
Posts: 2128
I have changed my mind in this topic
James Conner should be th starting rb even when bell comes back.
For a number of reasons
Chief of which in my mind is that this team desparatly needs some guys fighting for everything
I have little doubt Tomlin gives bell his job back but I wouldn't


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 9:18 pm
Posts: 11315
Gonzo wrote:
I have changed my mind in this topic
James Conner should be th starting rb even when bell comes back.
For a number of reasons
Chief of which in my mind is that this team desparatly needs some guys fighting for everything
I have little doubt Tomlin gives bell his job back but I wouldn't


We'll likely need both to make a run this year.

_________________
86n96 wrote:
Been checked to it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:34 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 2:46 pm
Posts: 1447
KC wrote:
Gonzo wrote:
I have changed my mind in this topic
James Conner should be th starting rb even when bell comes back.
For a number of reasons
Chief of which in my mind is that this team desparatly needs some guys fighting for everything
I have little doubt Tomlin gives bell his job back but I wouldn't


We'll likely need both to make a run this year.


Exactly. I’m not totally convinced bell will ere play this year, but let all these teams get banged up to shit.

Do I want to see bell on fresh legs in week 12? Yeah

Make that hell yeah.

The news on bell is so hard to figure out. But near as I can decipher he is not pleased about the prospect of Steelers using the transition tag on him. And sounds like he may be willing to play this season so he can get to true FA with no strings or even resign with Steelers. I seriously think that’s a possibility now.

Any rate one of the top O players in the game today returns to the fold for the stretch you don’t look that gift horse in the mouth


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:55 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 2:46 pm
Posts: 1447
And James Conner to me is like Jessie James or Ramon foster. You need value guys like these. There’s nothing wrong with guys like these.

But when James Conner is featured Steelers tie the browns. When lev bell is featured Steelers win out the season and clinch home playoff game.

Not knocking Conner the dude or his season. He clearly belongs and I hope he’s part of the team long term.

But let’s not confuse contributor to season defining player


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:00 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:18 pm
Posts: 4672
Location: Sunny Delaware (but the murdery part)
When James Conner was featured, they beat the Falcons. Two of their non-losses featured Conner. Both their losses didn't.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:08 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:11 pm
Posts: 2128
it's still yggy wrote:
And James Conner to me is like Jessie James or Ramon foster. You need value guys like these. There’s nothing wrong with guys like these.

But when James Conner is featured Steelers tie the browns. When lev bell is featured Steelers win out the season and clinch home playoff game.

Not knocking Conner the dude or his season. He clearly belongs and I hope he’s part of the team long term.

But let’s not confuse contributor to season defining player



Maybe if we had a few more guys that gave a shit the steelers would have a season worthy of some definition in the last ten


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:10 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:18 pm
Posts: 4672
Location: Sunny Delaware (but the murdery part)
Gonzo wrote:
it's still yggy wrote:
And James Conner to me is like Jessie James or Ramon foster. You need value guys like these. There’s nothing wrong with guys like these.

But when James Conner is featured Steelers tie the browns. When lev bell is featured Steelers win out the season and clinch home playoff game.

Not knocking Conner the dude or his season. He clearly belongs and I hope he’s part of the team long term.

But let’s not confuse contributor to season defining player



Maybe if we had a few more guys that gave a shit the steelers would have a season worthy of some definition in the last ten


Agreed.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:23 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1704
it's still yggy wrote:
And James Conner to me is like Jessie James or Ramon foster. You need value guys like these. There’s nothing wrong with guys like these.

But when James Conner is featured Steelers tie the browns. When lev bell is featured Steelers win out the season and clinch home playoff game.

Not knocking Conner the dude or his season. He clearly belongs and I hope he’s part of the team long term.

But let’s not confuse contributor to season defining player


While Conner had a fumble in the Browns game I would say the fact that the QB was involved with another 5 turnovers is why you tie the browns. Also it is clear that Conner is a better football player than either James or Foster. That comparison is disingenuous.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:09 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:33 pm
Posts: 16267
stillthere wrote:
it's still yggy wrote:
And James Conner to me is like Jessie James or Ramon foster. You need value guys like these. There’s nothing wrong with guys like these.

But when James Conner is featured Steelers tie the browns. When lev bell is featured Steelers win out the season and clinch home playoff game.

Not knocking Conner the dude or his season. He clearly belongs and I hope he’s part of the team long term.

But let’s not confuse contributor to season defining player


While Conner had a fumble in the Browns game I would say the fact that the QB was involved with another 5 turnovers is why you tie the browns. Also it is clear that Conner is a better football player than either James or Foster. That comparison is disingenuous.

Conner is not a better player than Foster, sorry.

_________________
Suwanee88 wrote:
But it’s your fault that you are kind of a stubborn jagoff that would argue with a fence post


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:10 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:14 pm
Posts: 1897
B2B, yeah, comparing a player who has some 120 starts to a player who has started just 5 games, who is to say who is a better player??

Again, who is to say that Conner won't develop into a real good RB? Maybe he will end up being a better player than Foster as we look at him two years from now?

I think we shouldn't dismiss that Conner is probably a MORE Valuable player than Foster at this point. If Foster goes down we can just insert Finney and perhaps not really miss much. If Conner goes down? It is debatable if Ridley can do what Conner has done, especially as a receiver and probably as a pass blocker too.

In terms of Bell coming back I hope that they take Bell OFF the field on obvious passing situations. What? Is that laughter I hear? Making fun of my idea to take Bell off the field for Conner??

Yes, I am totally serious. Bell last year averaged 7.7 yards per catch. He had 85 catches and only produced 31 first downs, a 36.5% first down rate.

Conner this season is averaging 10.9 yards per catch, has 22 catches and has produced 10 first downs, a 45.5% first down rate. Lev Bell fans can suck it, Conner is the more effective pass catcher out of the backfield.

All of this nonsense that Bell is special as a pass catcher, that he is elite, what a joke. Defenses want the Steelers to throw to Bell, it means less first downs converted, less big plays. What Conner is doing this year proves it. Bell can't break tackles like Conner and his diminishing speed and quickness does not let him evade tacklers like he did in 2014.

_________________
#greendot51


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 2:23 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:11 pm
Posts: 2128
I think quality teams love it when we focus on the run and run extension passing


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:18 pm
Posts: 4672
Location: Sunny Delaware (but the murdery part)
Gonzo wrote:
I think quality teams love it when we focus on the run and run extension passing


With the exception of the Miami Dolphins and Kansas City Chefs in the playoffs the other year.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: James Conner
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:16 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1704
For those of you who have facebook this link has some nice ground level camera angles of Conner vs the Falcons in wk 5. It is like 3 mins long.

https://www.facebook.com/steelers/videos/437342753461022/


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 52 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 7forSteel, Google [Bot], Juststillin, Obviously and 17 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
FORUM RULES --- PRIVACY POLICY




Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group