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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:58 pm 
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Pabst wrote:
Poltargyst wrote:
R S wrote:
It's about 5 to 1. left to right wing news


Baloney.


Excluding those who identify as "independents", FiveThirtyEight found that Democrats outnumbered Republicans in the Media 4 to 1: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/there-really-was-a-liberal-media-bubble/

In sports media, that number is roughly 9 to 1: https://thebiglead.com/2017/03/08/big-lead-sports-media-politics-survey-only-4-of-media-surveyed-voted-for-donald-trump/

NPR's former CEO estimated that his newsroom was about 9 to 1 as well: https://nypost.com/2017/10/21/the-other ... snt-cover/

96% of campaign donations from journalists went to Clinton: https://www.publicintegrity.org/2016/10/17/20330/journalists-shower-hillary-clinton-campaign-cash

I've said this so many times (not on here): Trump is not the cause of media distrust, Trump is the result of media distrust. Fox News and Talk Radio exist because conservatives don't see their view represented in mainstream outlets.

It's irrelevent what the leanings of the individual journalists are, all that matters is what the leanings of the guy in charge are. Everyone else gets dictated to how they're going to report, and if the guy in charge is a Republican, and he dictates that all his liberal journalists are going to put a Republican spin on stories, then there will be a Republican spin on stories.

Our media is owned by big corporations. Big corporations want tax cuts and deregulation. It is the Republican party that promises corporations tax cuts and deregulation. Therefore, the corporations owning the media are motivated to have Republicans win. If you think the media is liberal biased, then tell me what their motivation for being so is, and that motivation needs to be bigger than the millions (billions?) of dollars they stand to gain through Republican tax cuts and deregulation.

I saw an article a little while ago about how the conservative Sinclair Broadcast Group owns all these local news stations, and they're dictating that their stations report stories with a conservative spin. It doesn't matter if Joe Blow local news ancor is a liberal, if he is ordered to read a story with a conservative spin, then he's reading the story with a conservative spin.

So, yes, this idea that the media is so liberal biased that poor conservatives can't get their message out is rubbish. This idea that of all the news sources we have on tv and radio that liberal ones outnumber conservative ones 5 or 6 or 8 or 9 to 1 is Bah. Loney.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:17 pm 
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Poltargyst wrote:
Our media is owned by big corporations. Big corporations want tax cuts and deregulation. It is the Republican party that promises corporations tax cuts and deregulation. Therefore, the corporations owning the media are motivated to have Republicans win. If you think the media is liberal biased, then tell me what their motivation for being so is, and that motivation needs to be bigger than the millions (billions?) of dollars they stand to gain through Republican tax cuts and deregulation.


This is the most intellectually bankrupt argument I've ever seen. You've never heard of a rich liberal? You've never heard of Silicon Valley? LOL is right.


BTW, Trump got BILLIONS in free coverage from mostly liberal media. CNN and MSNBC were covering him about 3X as much as Fox News, who had other Republican candidates they were trying to give time to.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:30 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
Poltargyst wrote:
Our media is owned by big corporations. Big corporations want tax cuts and deregulation. It is the Republican party that promises corporations tax cuts and deregulation. Therefore, the corporations owning the media are motivated to have Republicans win. If you think the media is liberal biased, then tell me what their motivation for being so is, and that motivation needs to be bigger than the millions (billions?) of dollars they stand to gain through Republican tax cuts and deregulation.


This is the most intellectually bankrupt argument I've ever seen. You've never heard of a rich liberal? You've never heard of Silicon Valley? LOL is right.


BTW, Trump got BILLIONS in free coverage from mostly liberal media. CNN and MSNBC were covering him about 3X as much as Fox News, who had other Republican candidates they were trying to give time to.

Yes, Trump absolutely benefitted from a lot of free coverage. And?

If I took the time to look up the political contributions of the corporations that own the major news outlets in this country, I wonder what I would find.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:36 pm 
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First during the Obama era and now during the Trump era, folks on both sides have been so trained to see black and white (no pun or racist base intended, just the old cliche) that none of you see that there is something else out there. You are so convinced its A party vs B party that you have lost independent thought.

Let's be clear ... I think third parties are and do want to influence our elections and our lives. It isn't for A or B to win. It's to convince people there is only A and B and then sow discord between the two.

If you think that the world operates in As and Bs you've already lost. If you are unable to think beyond As and Bs the country has already lost. You are giving "them" what they want.

I am not telling you to support or not support any particular politician. I am asking you to think about who really wins this. And it isn't A or B.

At this rate we are just waiting for the US to fall ... fighting over A or B ... while the world laughs at what was once something better.


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:56 pm 
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Now if all the other networks could get it right!

Quote:
(KDKA) – ESPN president Jimmy Pitaro told reporters Friday that the sports network will not televise the national anthem as part of its Monday Night Football broadcasts this season. https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2018/08 ... roadcasts/


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 10:18 pm 
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Steelafan77 wrote:
Now if all the other networks could get it right!

Quote:
(KDKA) – ESPN president Jimmy Pitaro told reporters Friday that the sports network will not televise the national anthem as part of its Monday Night Football broadcasts this season. https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2018/08 ... roadcasts/


Most never broadcast-ed it in the first place. But assuming they did, this kills off the point of the anthem and the protest at the same time. Who wins that?


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 10:54 pm 
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Steel Reign wrote:
Steelafan77 wrote:
Now if all the other networks could get it right!

Quote:
(KDKA) – ESPN president Jimmy Pitaro told reporters Friday that the sports network will not televise the national anthem as part of its Monday Night Football broadcasts this season. https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2018/08 ... roadcasts/


Most never broadcast-ed it in the first place. But assuming they did, this kills off the point of the anthem and the protest at the same time. Who wins that?

People tuning in to watch a football game

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 5:24 am 
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Poltargyst wrote:
If I took the time to look up the political contributions of the corporations that own the major news outlets in this country, I wonder what I would find.


You should do that - and I mean you really should because you're horribly misinformed. And with pretty much everything before you post something on politics. Your ignorance leaves me absolutely speechless.

LMFAO I honestly thought that was all /sarcafont trolling. Holy fucking christ you were actually serious.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:28 am 
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Poltargyst wrote:

If I took the time to look up the political contributions of the corporations that own the major news outlets in this country, I wonder what I would find.


You would find that corporations play the field. They support both parties. Generally they support the party in power more. This election cycle is an odd one as corps are betting on a flip at the midterms.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/summar ... D000000227

Opensecrets is a decent site to see who is spending on lobbying and canidates as it all must be reported. SuperPacs are the exception and should be banned or made to show their donors.

This is a list of all the top donors

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:19 am 
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Steel Reign wrote:
First during the Obama era and now during the Trump era, folks on both sides have been so trained to see black and white (no pun or racist base intended, just the old cliche) that none of you see that there is something else out there. You are so convinced its A party vs B party that you have lost independent thought.

Let's be clear ... I think third parties are and do want to influence our elections and our lives. It isn't for A or B to win. It's to convince people there is only A and B and then sow discord between the two.

If you think that the world operates in As and Bs you've already lost. If you are unable to think beyond As and Bs the country has already lost. You are giving "them" what they want.

I am not telling you to support or not support any particular politician. I am asking you to think about who really wins this. And it isn't A or B.

At this rate we are just waiting for the US to fall ... fighting over A or B ... while the world laughs at what was once something better.



I am not sure if many Americans truly grasp the level of disgust most of the developed world has developed for the USA over the past 2 years. I know dozens of Canadians, myself included who wont even consider doing a weekend away in the USA, we want no part of the calamity. In conversations with Europeans, on a recent trip, if the USA came up their disgust was evident. Britain a great ally wouldn't even let Cheatolini near London, the protests were so aggressive. The polite, courteous Brits, let that sink in for a minute.

And for what?? $30 a week tax cut for Joe the plummer which disappears in a couple of years?? Loosening regulations which amongst many things pollute the environment EVEN more and weaken banks again (remember 2007, thank you Obama).

Economy? pretty much EVERY developed economy is humming along at very healthy levels, not just the USA (thanks Obama). Do yourself a favour and look at world economies and unemployment rates right now, that is what free trade is supposed to do, raise all ships. Cheatolini has done nothing sage just given huge tax breaks to himself and cronies and started a trade war with several allies???

Leaders of the free world??? I know based on metrics like availability and cost of health care, infant mortality rates, overall quality of life, incarceration rates, happiness quotients, obesity rates, cost of education, murder rates, drug dependency/abuse, etc etc etc the american system aint workin out so well, and the world is saying WTF are they doing?


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:33 pm 
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Heard a guy talking on a sports medicine radio program. He is a doctor. Obviously highly successful. He's black.

He told a story of an experience he had with cops once. Listening to him speak... his argument was not that this was a pattern of his own experience but that he had 1 bad experience and white people don't have to put up with that. But his 1 bad experience is similar to an experience I had when I was in my 20's with 2 asshole cops.

Regarding the experience I had in my 20's... Those 2 cops had zero reason to put me thru that. They were just assholes looking for on an opportunity to be assholes. But I did not give them attitude in return. I did everything they asked. I did not question them. Then they let me go on my way. But at that age on a different day I might have given them some attitude or some shit and who knows what might have happened.

I know a black woman, who recently told me a story of being pulled over. She said the cop was rude... but by the end of the story she sheepishly admitted that she gave him a lot of shit. They had to bring another officer to the scene, and she told me that officer was great. Said he was very nice to her. She said because of him she signed the traffic ticket. That's right all of that over a stupid traffic ticket which up until that point she had refused to sign. Based on everything she told me meaning all the attitude and shit she gave the officers... she's lucky they didn't haul her ass in. But that's the kind of shit cops have to deal with and my guess is that it's probably getting worse for them.

I do not like cops as a group. Don't trust them. Don't view them as my friend. None of that is because of my own experience. It's because of what I know of human behavior. Even though as a group I don't like them... individually I might and have.

But seeing what is happening in this country... the mindless cop bashing... makes me want to defend them. I said mindless but that's not the driving force behind it. It's idealogue agenda driven and it serves the purpose whether real or imagined.

I'll end with this...

Adults with ideology are like kids with matches. The ideologue mind is a blind one.


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 1:35 pm 
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Havoc wrote:
Heard a guy talking on a sports medicine radio program. He is a doctor. Obviously highly successful. He's black.

He told a story of an experience he had with cops once. Listening to him speak... his argument was not that this was a pattern of his own experience but that he had 1 bad experience and white people don't have to put up with that. But his 1 bad experience is similar to an experience I had when I was in my 20's with 2 asshole cops.

Regarding the experience I had in my 20's... Those 2 cops had zero reason to put me thru that. They were just assholes looking for on an opportunity to be assholes. But I did not give them attitude in return. I did everything they asked. I did not question them. Then they let me go on my way. But at that age on a different day I might have given them some attitude or some shit and who knows what might have happened.

I know a black woman, who recently told me a story of being pulled over. She said the cop was rude... but by the end of the story she sheepishly admitted that she gave him a lot of shit. They had to bring another officer to the scene, and she told me that officer was great. Said he was very nice to her. She said because of him she signed the traffic ticket. That's right all of that over a stupid traffic ticket which up until that point she had refused to sign. Based on everything she told me meaning all the attitude and shit she gave the officers... she's lucky they didn't haul her ass in. But that's the kind of shit cops have to deal with and my guess is that it's probably getting worse for them.

I do not like cops as a group. Don't trust them. Don't view them as my friend. None of that is because of my own experience. It's because of what I know of human behavior. Even though as a group I don't like them... individually I might and have.

But seeing what is happening in this country... the mindless cop bashing... makes me want to defend them. I said mindless but that's not the driving force behind it. It's idealogue agenda driven and it serves the purpose whether real or imagined.

I'll end with this...

Adults with ideology are like kids with matches. The ideologue mind is a blind one.


This is a great post. It reminds me of something that happened in my youth where a manager of a local teen hangout improperly called the police on me and my friends. The police sorted it out without any report, etc.

Now, maybe it goes down differently if I were black. OTOH, maybe it goes down the same but I attribute the managers actions to racism instead of a combination of being a jerk / being on edge because of an incident that had happened a couple of weeks prior. Point being, that when people are taught race infects everything they may start to believe race infects everything.


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 1:49 pm 
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Zeke5123 wrote:
Point being, that when people are taught race infects everything they may start to believe race infects everything.


Of course, race may darn well enter quite a bit without outright racism entering with it.

Implicit bias is a real thing.

Just as empirical psychology has demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt that we alter memories at the time we recall them (we just about NEVER remember anything exactly as it happened), it has also gotten close to showing that most judgments are affected by all kinds of bias. It would be great if we could flip a switch and just be inferential automata. But we can't. It would be much better for people to recognize their bias so that they can better spot it when making judgments. And that goes for everyone, including those who see race in everything. I know damn well that I am differently affected when I see a group of black men walking toward me than I do when I see a group of white dudes. That's not racism but it is sure as shit bias.

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2016/12/cover-policing.aspx

Quote:
Joshua Correll, PhD, a psychologist at the University of Colorado, has explored one facet of implicit racial bias in a series of laboratory studies since 2000. He developed and tested a paradigm known as "the police officer's dilemma," using a first-person-shooter video game. Participants are presented with images of young men, white and black, holding either guns or innocuous objects such as cellphones or soda cans. The goal is to shoot armed targets but not unarmed targets.

The researchers found that participants shoot armed targets more often and more quickly if they're black rather than white, and refrain from shooting more often when the target is white. The most common mistakes are shooting an unarmed black target and failing to shoot an armed white target (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2002).
But experiments with police officers show a more complex pattern. Similar to community participants, officers showed evidence of bias in their reaction times, more quickly reacting to armed black targets and unarmed white targets—in other words, targets that aligned with racial stereotypes. But those biases evident in their reaction times did not translate to their ultimate decision to shoot or not shoot (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2007). Still, that's only part of the story. In later work, Correll found special unit officers who regularly interact with minority gang members were more likely to exhibit racial bias in their decision to shoot. When officers' training and experiences confirm racial stereotypes, those biases appear to hold more sway over their behavior (Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 2013).

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:14 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:08 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
Poltargyst wrote:
If I took the time to look up the political contributions of the corporations that own the major news outlets in this country, I wonder what I would find.


You should do that - and I mean you really should because you're horribly misinformed. And with pretty much everything before you post something on politics. Your ignorance leaves me absolutely speechless.

LMFAO I honestly thought that was all /sarcafont trolling. Holy fucking christ you were actually serious.

The statement I was reacting to was the "5 or 6 liberal media sources for evey 1 conservative media source." If that statement was supposed to mean that if I as a Democrat turn on my tv I should find 5 or 6 MSNBC's for every Fox...no. No way. No such thing. And if that statement was supposed to mean that the mainstream news sources consistently coddle liberals and mistreat conservatives...no I don't buy it. I've seen mainstream news sources wrong Democrats and frankly help Republicans too many times. So there has to be a reason for it. If you don't like my assertion that corporations tend to be conservative and it's reflected in what their news puts out, okay. Maybe it's just that media are businesses and they want to make a profit and so run with whatever they think will get viewers. If that means bashing a Clinton one day and a Trump the next, they're okay with that, and maybe that's why both sides feel abused. I think the mainstream media is conservative, but I could make that compromise. But no way is the mainstream media in the pocket of Democrats. No fuckin way.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:10 pm 
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Steel Reign wrote:
First during the Obama era and now during the Trump era, folks on both sides have been so trained to see black and white (no pun or racist base intended, just the old cliche) that none of you see that there is something else out there. You are so convinced its A party vs B party that you have lost independent thought.

Let's be clear ... I think third parties are and do want to influence our elections and our lives. It isn't for A or B to win. It's to convince people there is only A and B and then sow discord between the two.

If you think that the world operates in As and Bs you've already lost. If you are unable to think beyond As and Bs the country has already lost. You are giving "them" what they want.

I am not telling you to support or not support any particular politician. I am asking you to think about who really wins this. And it isn't A or B.

At this rate we are just waiting for the US to fall ... fighting over A or B ... while the world laughs at what was once something better.

Okay, what is really going on? Who's "them"?

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:09 am 
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Donnie Brasco wrote:
Suwanee88 wrote:
I think the NFL Players are protesting bad cops....that’s mostly white cops who shoot innocentt blapck people.

A simple solution to the problem. All cops must have body cameras on the job .let the pubic see what the cops are dealing with and how they are handling the situation.

That would remove all excuses from both sides.

Another simple rule for all people stopped by the police if you don’t comply, prepare to die.


Its funny you say that because about a month ago around here there were white 2 cops chasing a black man. He was a suspect in a string of convenience store robberies that involved him brandishing a firearm.
Suspect is running while the cruiser is following and another cop on foot. Suspect clearly has a gun in his waistband and reaches for it. Cops smoke him. Clear video evidence is below

Yet somehow the black community was up in arms about this. There was a minor civil disturbance immediately after the shooting- people throwing rocks on police and spitting on them. In fact one of the first eye witnesses claimed that she and her 10 year old son saw everything and that the suspect didn't even have a gun- they shot him in the back is what she claimed. This is how you get the "hands up don't shoot" shit that permeated the Missouri situation.

Others when shown the video: "They were harassing him" "He didn't even point his gun at them" were some of the excuses why this wasn't justified.



So what exactly am I missing from the eyes of the black community here? Seems like there is a persecution complex to me

Sounds like a black community problem to me.

If you run from the cops with or without a gun, Black or White, there is a good chance you may die.


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:33 am 
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Suwanee88 wrote:
If you run from the cops with or without a gun, Black or White, there is a good chance you may die.


Yes....Points off for not making that about race.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:37 am 
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Poltargyst wrote:
The statement I was reacting to was


I was very clear with what I said. I don't think you're an idiot, but your post indicates that maybe you are, at least with respect to politics. You're pretty much the identity politics poster child.

Your posts have been ignorant, and inflammatory. If you want to have an honest debate otherwise, it will not end up with you looking anything other than stupid. Deep down you already know this, but your inclination is to elicit sympathy by blaming that on race.

And I find that offensive. As should everyone.


Back to the original question....Go use google and fucking learn something.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:15 am 
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jebrick wrote:
You would find that corporations play the field.


You're very diplomatic.
He's part of the problem. He needs to be shamed for being stupid. Toxically ignorant....When feelings are submitted as fact it's no longer a debate.

Allow me to illustrate the misperception......I told my friend I've been surprised I didn't get pulled over doing 80mph as I went past a cop.....He thought he knew why - I said "tinted windows at night doing 80....you think he could see if I was white or black?". Silence. End of conversation.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:24 am 
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Still Lit wrote:
Zeke5123 wrote:
Point being, that when people are taught race infects everything they may start to believe race infects everything.


Of course, race may darn well enter quite a bit without outright racism entering with it.

Implicit bias is a real thing.

Just as empirical psychology has demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt that we alter memories at the time we recall them (we just about NEVER remember anything exactly as it happened), it has also gotten close to showing that most judgments are affected by all kinds of bias. It would be great if we could flip a switch and just be inferential automata. But we can't. It would be much better for people to recognize their bias so that they can better spot it when making judgments. And that goes for everyone, including those who see race in everything. I know damn well that I am differently affected when I see a group of black men walking toward me than I do when I see a group of white dudes. That's not racism but it is sure as shit bias.

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2016/12/cover-policing.aspx

Quote:
Joshua Correll, PhD, a psychologist at the University of Colorado, has explored one facet of implicit racial bias in a series of laboratory studies since 2000. He developed and tested a paradigm known as "the police officer's dilemma," using a first-person-shooter video game. Participants are presented with images of young men, white and black, holding either guns or innocuous objects such as cellphones or soda cans. The goal is to shoot armed targets but not unarmed targets.

The researchers found that participants shoot armed targets more often and more quickly if they're black rather than white, and refrain from shooting more often when the target is white. The most common mistakes are shooting an unarmed black target and failing to shoot an armed white target (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2002).
But experiments with police officers show a more complex pattern. Similar to community participants, officers showed evidence of bias in their reaction times, more quickly reacting to armed black targets and unarmed white targets—in other words, targets that aligned with racial stereotypes. But those biases evident in their reaction times did not translate to their ultimate decision to shoot or not shoot (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2007). Still, that's only part of the story. In later work, Correll found special unit officers who regularly interact with minority gang members were more likely to exhibit racial bias in their decision to shoot. When officers' training and experiences confirm racial stereotypes, those biases appear to hold more sway over their behavior (Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 2013).



1. I think I made it clear that race can affect outcomes. My point was that lived experiences may overstate racism because it can easily ascribe bad behavior to racism when such behavior is caused by other factors. This isn’t to say people are lying; instead, I honestly believe they believe what they are saying. But it doesn’t mean what they are saying reflects reality.

2. The replication crises makes psychological research suspect, especially when it comports with fashionable beliefs. The IAT (or implicit bias) failed to replicate. See http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... oblem.html.

3. Finally, while I do believe we have biases sometimes I think the psychologist-cum-economists misconstrue what is a bias. Eg, hyperbolic discounting. Let’s say for services rendered I offer you a payment today and a payment in a year. For the payment today, I offer you a dollar today or two dollars tomorrow. For the payment in a year from now I offer you a dollar in a year from now and two dollars in a year + 1 day from now. Many people choose the dollar today and the two dollars a year + 1 day from now. Richard Thaler and co. would tell us this is an example of biased thinking. I’m not so sure — can you spot the problem in the bias?


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:56 am 
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Still Lit wrote:
Zeke5123 wrote:
Point being, that when people are taught race infects everything they may start to believe race infects everything.


Of course, race may darn well enter quite a bit without outright racism entering with it.

Implicit bias is a real thing.

Just as empirical psychology has demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt that we alter memories at the time we recall them (we just about NEVER remember anything exactly as it happened), it has also gotten close to showing that most judgments are affected by all kinds of bias. It would be great if we could flip a switch and just be inferential automata. But we can't. It would be much better for people to recognize their bias so that they can better spot it when making judgments. And that goes for everyone, including those who see race in everything. I know damn well that I am differently affected when I see a group of black men walking toward me than I do when I see a group of white dudes. That's not racism but it is sure as shit bias.

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2016/12/cover-policing.aspx

Quote:
Joshua Correll, PhD, a psychologist at the University of Colorado, has explored one facet of implicit racial bias in a series of laboratory studies since 2000. He developed and tested a paradigm known as "the police officer's dilemma," using a first-person-shooter video game. Participants are presented with images of young men, white and black, holding either guns or innocuous objects such as cellphones or soda cans. The goal is to shoot armed targets but not unarmed targets.

The researchers found that participants shoot armed targets more often and more quickly if they're black rather than white, and refrain from shooting more often when the target is white. The most common mistakes are shooting an unarmed black target and failing to shoot an armed white target (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2002).
But experiments with police officers show a more complex pattern. Similar to community participants, officers showed evidence of bias in their reaction times, more quickly reacting to armed black targets and unarmed white targets—in other words, targets that aligned with racial stereotypes. But those biases evident in their reaction times did not translate to their ultimate decision to shoot or not shoot (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2007). Still, that's only part of the story. In later work, Correll found special unit officers who regularly interact with minority gang members were more likely to exhibit racial bias in their decision to shoot. When officers' training and experiences confirm racial stereotypes, those biases appear to hold more sway over their behavior (Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 2013).


Maybe we should be talking about Interpretive Bias too, specifically within the Black community?

"Interpretive bias or interpretation bias is an information-processing bias, the tendency to inappropriately analyze ambiguous stimuli, scenarios and events.[1] One type of interpretive bias is hostile attribution bias, wherein individuals perceive benign or ambiguous behaviors as hostile."

While I am not discounting the biases you mentioned above, there is a duty upon those who are perceived as "persecuted" to understand there are some situations where police intervention (stopping/questioning) is justified.


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:58 am 
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Donnie Brasco wrote:
Maybe...


Oh no you didn't....

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:04 am 
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Suwanee88 wrote:
Donnie Brasco wrote:
Suwanee88 wrote:
I think the NFL Players are protesting bad cops....that’s mostly white cops who shoot innocentt blapck people.

A simple solution to the problem. All cops must have body cameras on the job .let the pubic see what the cops are dealing with and how they are handling the situation.

That would remove all excuses from both sides.

Another simple rule for all people stopped by the police if you don’t comply, prepare to die.


Its funny you say that because about a month ago around here there were white 2 cops chasing a black man. He was a suspect in a string of convenience store robberies that involved him brandishing a firearm.
Suspect is running while the cruiser is following and another cop on foot. Suspect clearly has a gun in his waistband and reaches for it. Cops smoke him. Clear video evidence is below

Yet somehow the black community was up in arms about this. There was a minor civil disturbance immediately after the shooting- people throwing rocks on police and spitting on them. In fact one of the first eye witnesses claimed that she and her 10 year old son saw everything and that the suspect didn't even have a gun- they shot him in the back is what she claimed. This is how you get the "hands up don't shoot" shit that permeated the Missouri situation.

Others when shown the video: "They were harassing him" "He didn't even point his gun at them" were some of the excuses why this wasn't justified.



So what exactly am I missing from the eyes of the black community here? Seems like there is a persecution complex to me

Sounds like a black community problem to me.



That can't be it. That's not the narrative that the NFL players are parroting and the media is reporting

/s


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Players Renew Anthem Protests
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:15 am 
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Zeke5123 wrote:
1. I think I made it clear that race can affect outcomes. My point was that lived experiences may overstate racism because it can easily ascribe bad behavior to racism when such behavior is caused by other factors. This isn’t to say people are lying; instead, I honestly believe they believe what they are saying. But it doesn’t mean what they are saying reflects reality.

2. The replication crises makes psychological research suspect, especially when it comports with fashionable beliefs. The IAT (or implicit bias) failed to replicate. See http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... oblem.html.

3. Finally, while I do believe we have biases sometimes I think the psychologist-cum-economists misconstrue what is a bias. Eg, hyperbolic discounting. Let’s say for services rendered I offer you a payment today and a payment in a year. For the payment today, I offer you a dollar today or two dollars tomorrow. For the payment in a year from now I offer you a dollar I’m a year and two dollars in a year + 1 day from now. Many people choose the dollar today and the two dollars a year + 1 day from now. Richard Thaler and co. would tell us this is an example of biased thinking. I’m not so sure — can you spot the problem in the bias?


1. Meant only to add to the discussion, not critiquing: there was nothing wrong with what your said.

2. Not going to start a philosophy of science war, but we should not expect human psychological phenomena to replicate in the way that other natural phenomena do. That is, you may appeal to standards inappropriate for psychological research.

3. Can you clarify the bolded? Typo there, I think.

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