It is currently Sun Nov 18, 2018 4:16 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 44 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:57 pm
Posts: 3180
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Nothing wrong with the pass rush or pass rush strategy... they were excellent last year, even with Dupree, Hargrave, & Tuitt apparently playing at less than 100% health. I'm excited to see Keion Adams added to the mix, and the addition of Joshua Frazier covers for the risk of Hargrave not playing up to his best of 2016.

I thought safety play the past two years was a huge problem... apparently, they agreed, and they did something about it.

They struggled to stop the run because:
A. missed tackles
B. failure to address ILB roster depth in august/september
C. three players in starting front 7 were playing with back or upper body injuries
D. Artie Burns

I hope C. will be better with health. A should be improved, simply because most of the personnel has improved. B. is still unaddressed unless Morgan Burnett or one of the other safeties is going to play ILB in nickel.

Giving up an inordinate number of over 40 yard plays is a huge problem that will likely revert to the mean... but I am sure hoping for some competition for Artie Burns.


F. Failure to hold Edge with OLBs ( some of that had to do with depth)
G. Did anyone mention poor play by the ILB ( including Shazier).

_________________
To doubt everything or to believe everything are two equally convenient solutions; both dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Henri Poincaré


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:03 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:33 pm
Posts: 16557
jebrick wrote:
bradshaw2ben wrote:
Nothing wrong with the pass rush or pass rush strategy... they were excellent last year, even with Dupree, Hargrave, & Tuitt apparently playing at less than 100% health. I'm excited to see Keion Adams added to the mix, and the addition of Joshua Frazier covers for the risk of Hargrave not playing up to his best of 2016.

I thought safety play the past two years was a huge problem... apparently, they agreed, and they did something about it.

They struggled to stop the run because:
A. missed tackles
B. failure to address ILB roster depth in august/september
C. three players in starting front 7 were playing with back or upper body injuries
D. Artie Burns

I hope C. will be better with health. A should be improved, simply because most of the personnel has improved. B. is still unaddressed unless Morgan Burnett or one of the other safeties is going to play ILB in nickel.

Giving up an inordinate number of over 40 yard plays is a huge problem that will likely revert to the mean... but I am sure hoping for some competition for Artie Burns.


F. Failure to hold Edge with OLBs ( some of that had to do with depth)
G. Did anyone mention poor play by the ILB ( including Shazier).

Dupree will be better at his run responsibilities on the right side... more chasing from behind than 2-gapping. Watt will be a good rusher from teh left side, but run fits are goign to be all kinds of fun. My guess is that we're slowly becoming more of a 4-3 stop the run on the way to the passer team... have to have agile, athletic ILB(s) to run and chase. Or Safeties, I guess.

_________________
VASteelerGuy wrote:
These refs suck


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:49 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:01 am
Posts: 11624
I remember the last time Tomlin talked about versatility.....it seems that was forgettable.

_________________
------------------------------------------------------


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:32 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:41 pm
Posts: 983
Kodiak wrote:
I remember the last time Tomlin talked about versatility.....it seems that was forgettable.

Yeah, but that was all about the OL, something which Tomlin, as a coach and a player, knew (knows) very little about...

...his OC at the time offered almost no help in that regard, too...

One would hope it's a different story on the defensive side of the ball...
I mean, he IS a former DC with an impressive pre-Steelers resume, but that was a dozen years ago, so we shall see...

_________________
http://steelerfury.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=365&p=14295#p14295


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:03 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:47 am
Posts: 4341
Steeledge wrote:
Kodiak wrote:
I remember the last time Tomlin talked about versatility.....it seems that was forgettable.

Yeah, but that was all about the OL, something which Tomlin, as a coach and a player, knew (knows) very little about...

...his OC at the time offered almost no help in that regard, too...

One would hope it's a different story on the defensive side of the ball...
I mean, he IS a former DC with an impressive pre-Steelers resume, but that was a dozen years ago, so we shall see...


Mike Tomlin's coaching resume pre steelers is very thin.

A whopping 1 year as Vikings DC which was nothing to get excited about as far as I can tell.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:36 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:41 pm
Posts: 983
Havoc wrote:
Steeledge wrote:
Kodiak wrote:
I remember the last time Tomlin talked about versatility.....it seems that was forgettable.

Yeah, but that was all about the OL, something which Tomlin, as a coach and a player, knew (knows) very little about...

...his OC at the time offered almost no help in that regard, too...

One would hope it's a different story on the defensive side of the ball...
I mean, he IS a former DC with an impressive pre-Steelers resume, but that was a dozen years ago, so we shall see...


Mike Tomlin's coaching resume pre steelers is very thin.

A whopping 1 year as Vikings DC which was nothing to get excited about as far as I can tell.

Oh, I'm completely with you!

...but there are a TON of Tomlin apologists on "board" for this ride...

it's just about knowing the audience... ;)

_________________
http://steelerfury.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=365&p=14295#p14295


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:42 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:58 pm
Posts: 6980
Steeledge wrote:
Havoc wrote:
Steeledge wrote:
Yeah, but that was all about the OL, something which Tomlin, as a coach and a player, knew (knows) very little about...

...his OC at the time offered almost no help in that regard, too...

One would hope it's a different story on the defensive side of the ball...
I mean, he IS a former DC with an impressive pre-Steelers resume, but that was a dozen years ago, so we shall see...


Mike Tomlin's coaching resume pre steelers is very thin.

A whopping 1 year as Vikings DC which was nothing to get excited about as far as I can tell.

Oh, I'm completely with you!

...but there are a TON of Tomlin apologists on "board" for this ride...

it's just about knowing the audience... ;)

Ehhh...I wouldn’t say a ton. Just a very loud minority, including a handful that will come charging in on their white stallion to defend his honor at the slightest hint of criticism. :lol:

_________________
"They're standing around, Butz!" - Kevin O'Shea


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:41 pm
Posts: 983
Jobus Rum wrote:
Steeledge wrote:
Havoc wrote:
Mike Tomlin's coaching resume pre steelers is very thin.

A whopping 1 year as Vikings DC which was nothing to get excited about as far as I can tell.

Oh, I'm completely with you!

...but there are a TON of Tomlin apologists on "board" for this ride...

it's just about knowing the audience... ;)

Ehhh...I wouldn’t say a ton. Just a very loud minority, including a handful that will come charging in on their white stallion to defend his honor at the slightest hint of criticism. :lol:

It's the close ties that this "un-silent minority" have with the folks that run this website that I'm concerning myself with...

...and did you seriously use the term "white" stallion?!

:o



;)

_________________
http://steelerfury.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=365&p=14295#p14295


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:58 pm
Posts: 6980
:oops:

_________________
"They're standing around, Butz!" - Kevin O'Shea


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 2:10 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:11 pm
Posts: 1909
Havoc wrote:
Steeledge wrote:
Kodiak wrote:
I remember the last time Tomlin talked about versatility.....it seems that was forgettable.

Yeah, but that was all about the OL, something which Tomlin, as a coach and a player, knew (knows) very little about...

...his OC at the time offered almost no help in that regard, too...

One would hope it's a different story on the defensive side of the ball...
I mean, he IS a former DC with an impressive pre-Steelers resume, but that was a dozen years ago, so we shall see...


Mike Tomlin's coaching resume pre steelers is very thin.

A whopping 1 year as Vikings DC which was nothing to get excited about as far as I can tell.


He has more football experience as an offensive guy since he played WR growing up (at least in college so I assume he did so in HS and maybe before hand) then a couple of years as a secondary coach with Tampa and 1 season as a DC in Minn. He should really be more of an offensive mind than a defensive mind. NFL is weird like that though. Brian Billick is a prime example his being hired in Baltimore was due to his O putting up insane #'s in Minn and then in Baltimore the D carried the team his entire tenure.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:12 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:19 am
Posts: 9853
Colin Cowherd, who regularly skewers Tomlin, has a much more sober perspective than most of the harshest Tomlin critics on this board.

I think this take is spot on:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAlkbRz1SUs&t=

Sure, fire Tomlin, but be prepared for the coach that replaces him to be worse. That is the overwhelming likelihood in my opinion. Just be thankful you're not a Saints fan or a Packers fan. You'd be even more pissed off.

_________________
Orangesteel wrote:
We could have ended the game there and Tomlin’s band of assholes let them back in.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:51 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:47 am
Posts: 4341
stillthere wrote:
Havoc wrote:
Mike Tomlin's coaching resume pre steelers is very thin.

A whopping 1 year as Vikings DC which was nothing to get excited about as far as I can tell.


He has more football experience as an offensive guy since he played WR growing up (at least in college so I assume he did so in HS and maybe before hand) then a couple of years as a secondary coach with Tampa and 1 season as a DC in Minn. He should really be more of an offensive mind than a defensive mind. NFL is weird like that though. Brian Billick is a prime example his being hired in Baltimore was due to his O putting up insane #'s in Minn and then in Baltimore the D carried the team his entire tenure.


Yeah, I was just giving the highlight(s) which in this case totaled 1 season.

We got rid of Haley, so I'm hoping for the best with Tomlin moving forward. This is going to be a very very interesting season for so many reasons. Can't wait to see it all play out.

It strikes me as odd that a former wr seems so set on the idea of needing a bell cow rb in today's nfl (with a HOF qb and HOF wr on the roster). But then again, we did draft Samuels.. so maybe this is a sign our FO including Tomlin is adapting to a changing league? Maybe I will think differently of Tomlin after this season. Like I said, hoping for the best. We will see.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:30 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:41 pm
Posts: 983
Still Lit wrote:
Just be thankful you're not a Saints fan or a Packers fan. You'd be even more pissed off.

Meh, I don't recall Sean Payton or Mike McCarthy stepping on the field to thwart a hated rival's kickoff return at a crucial moment, forcing their entire franchise to have to live down that humiliation (just one example off the top of my head), but whatevs...

_________________
http://steelerfury.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=365&p=14295#p14295


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:46 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:01 am
Posts: 11624
See, I don't agree with Cowherd.

I think most coaches are pretty average, some are better Mon-Sat and some are better on Sun, but they're mostly competent at the job. They tend to be risk averse and stick to convention and popular wisdom (i.e. mediocre). Tomlin is one of those guys.

Sure, the bad coaches outnumber the truly good coaches, but 80% of them are probably just average...and I don't think PIT would hire a bad coach. I really see nothing but upside to replacing Tomlin.

_________________
------------------------------------------------------


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:55 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:19 am
Posts: 9853
Steeledge wrote:
Still Lit wrote:
Just be thankful you're not a Saints fan or a Packers fan. You'd be even more pissed off.

Meh, I don't recall Sean Payton or Mike McCarthy stepping on the field to thwart a hated rival's kickoff return at a crucial moment, forcing their entire franchise to have to live down that humiliation (just one example off the top of my head), but whatevs...


They have Rodgers and Brees and worse records. But whatevs.

_________________
Orangesteel wrote:
We could have ended the game there and Tomlin’s band of assholes let them back in.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 12:00 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:19 am
Posts: 9853
Kodiak wrote:
See, I don't agree with Cowherd.

I think most coaches are pretty average, some are better Mon-Sat and some are better on Sun, but they're mostly competent at the job. They tend to be risk averse and stick to convention and popular wisdom (i.e. mediocre). Tomlin is one of those guys.

Sure, the bad coaches outnumber the truly good coaches, but 80% of them are probably just average...and I don't think PIT would hire a bad coach. I really see nothing but upside to replacing Tomlin.


Fair enough. But I look at Green Bay and the Saints and I start thinking that maybe Mike is not as much a dumpster fire as some folks suppose. This is Cowherd's point.

And I would add that I don't care about the Tomlin having Ben argument. Because no coach is winning without a franchise. The only coach consistently making deep pushes in the past decade and a half with a franchise is Belichick. Who else is/has?

_________________
Orangesteel wrote:
We could have ended the game there and Tomlin’s band of assholes let them back in.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:26 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:01 am
Posts: 11624
Still Lit wrote:
Fair enough. But I look at Green Bay and the Saints and I start thinking that maybe Mike is not as much a dumpster fire as some folks suppose. This is Cowherd's point.


I still think Colbert is one of the best GM's in football. That's a big part of the equation.

Most of Tomlin's success came with players and coaches he inherited. His track record the last 5-6 years really isn't any better than GB or NO.

_________________
------------------------------------------------------


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:40 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:33 pm
Posts: 16557
Kodiak wrote:
Still Lit wrote:
Fair enough. But I look at Green Bay and the Saints and I start thinking that maybe Mike is not as much a dumpster fire as some folks suppose. This is Cowherd's point.


I still think Colbert is one of the best GM's in football. That's a big part of the equation.

Most of Tomlin's success came with players and coaches he inherited. His track record the last 5-6 years really isn't any better than GB or NO.

Last 5 years
Ben 49-24 (.671)
Rodgers 42-22 (.656)
Brees 43-36 (.544)

Last 6 years
Rodgers 53-27 (.663)
Ben 56-30 (.651)
Brees 50-45 (.526)

_________________
VASteelerGuy wrote:
These refs suck


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 6:11 pm
Posts: 2153
Well if the job is to a generate a repeatable pattern that gets you to 9-7 10-6 and into the playoffs most of the time only PT be victimised by having that repeatable pattern attacked ... well than harrumphs all around


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: We have a lot of versatile guys
PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:51 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:55 pm
Posts: 4490
Still Lit wrote:
Steeledge wrote:
Still Lit wrote:
Just be thankful you're not a Saints fan or a Packers fan. You'd be even more pissed off.

Meh, I don't recall Sean Payton or Mike McCarthy stepping on the field to thwart a hated rival's kickoff return at a crucial moment, forcing their entire franchise to have to live down that humiliation (just one example off the top of my head), but whatevs...


They have Rodgers and Brees and worse records. But whatevs.


And also appreciably worse rosters


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 44 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baltostiller, Google [Bot] and 28 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
FORUM RULES --- PRIVACY POLICY




Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group