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 Post subject: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 11:02 am 
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http://www.steelersdepot.com/2018/05/fo ... skip-otas/


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 12:51 pm 
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From the article...

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“water is wet”


Last edited by Havoc on Tue May 22, 2018 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 1:34 pm 
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Is Bell missing OTAs and training camp such a bad thing?

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 2:52 pm 
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StillerInCT wrote:
Is Bell missing OTAs and training camp such a bad thing?


Over the last couple seasons, he's gotten off to pretty slow starts, and you could definitely blame it on reps/timing in OTAs/TC. If the plan is "run the wheels off," though, maybe the extra reps saved begat extra reps later.

Will Fitch's offense be significantly different from Haleyball? Bell is playing for a contract this year, and he's betting, obviously, that it won't be.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 5:07 pm 
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I normally don't say much, but get rid of him.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 5:57 pm 
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StillerInCT wrote:
Is Bell missing OTAs and training camp such a bad thing?



I think it could be great for Jaylin Samuels. The competition behind Bell is very, very underwhelming. That #2 job could become Samuels if he really is as smart and as good as advertised. And Bell is going to wait until the very last minute to sign that franchise tender, last year wasn't it September 1st that he signed it? So, Samuels could be getting a lot of reps during training camp, during the preseason games, etc.

It is ironic really, if Samuels does end up having the rookie year that I think he can, 40 catches, maybe 1,000 all purpose yards (300 rushing, 400 receiving, 300 kick returns), 7 TDs, it may just mean that Bell does not have the gaudy numbers that he was hoping to get heading into free agency. Samuels has a chance to stealthly come in and steal playing time and production from Bell, and all because Bell will wait until September to sign his tender.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 6:19 pm 
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StillerInCT wrote:
Is Bell missing OTAs and training camp such a bad thing?


Using last year as an indicator..., missing OTA's, Camp and Preseason..., Yes! It is bad for timing, continuity and football shape. Took this jackwagon a month [roughly] before he was in football shape and longer to get on the same page as the offense. Even then Bell looked like he'd lost a step in the offseason that he never really fully re-discovered all season long. Bell is on the outside looking in it just hasn't physically happened yet.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 7:00 pm 
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When people say that Bell is going to continue to get the ball 100% of the time, I just disagree with that. There is nothing wrong with having a two headed RB attack, in fact it is more productive if you have two players that complement each other or are interchangeable.

Here is a game, what RB did which production:

(1) 350 carries, 1,852 yards, 5.3 yards per carry, 20 TDs, 139 receptions, 1,242 yards, 8.9 yard per catch and 5 TDs, 25 total TDs, 3,094 combined yardage.

(2) 345 carries, 1,599 yards, 4.6 yards per carry, 19 TDs, 85 receptions, 883 yards, 10.3 yards per catch, 5 TDs, 24 total TDs, 2,482 combined yardage.

(3) 321 carries, 1,291 yards, 4.0 yards per carry, 9 TDs, 85 receptions, 655 yards, 7.7 yards per catch, 2 TDs, 11 total TDs, 1,946 combined yardage.

Leveon Bell produced (3). The first two lines of stats were produced by a 1-2 combo, a 1a, 1b duo.

Ingram and Kamara produced (1) for the New Orleans Saints last season. Freeman/Coleman produced (2) for the Falcons in their Super Bowl season of 2016. I would rather have a 1-2 punch at RB that is able to produce like they did, able to score 24-25 TDs in a season rather than have a Bell by himself who scores 11 TDs in a season.

Tennessee went and got Dion Lewis to complement Derrick Henry. Chicago drafted Tarik Cohen to complement Jordan Howard. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain by having more than one RB who can play and be productive.

Leveon Bell is soon going to learn this lesson. I think Fitchner IS going to change things, I think the ball is going to be distributed more, I think Brown and Bell will see their production come down. With JuJu, McDonald, Samuels, Washington, there is no damn good reason for Bell to have more than 60 receptions, or for Brown to have 100+ anymore. They have to distribute the football, there are playmakers everywhere, at each level, there is no need to continue to excessively feed/force the ball to Bell and Brown.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 7:47 pm 
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id be glad if we got a starter on defense for this distraction..hes on the down hill side of his career and not worth the cap hit. let alone the drama from his actions and mouth.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2018 8:09 pm 
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While there's nothing wrong (and in fact, a lot of positives) to being multiple at RB, I will need to see it to believe it while Bell is in the fold.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 7:08 am 
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Wasn't that big of a deal when it was Parker and Bettis. Or Bettis and Staley? Why not have a dual threat at RB. I've been wondering why they haven't returned to that type of offense. A big quick footed bowling ball and a smaller but tree trunk solid scat back. Both capable of catching passes like a receiver.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 9:18 am 
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Steelafan77 wrote:
Wasn't that big of a deal when it was Parker and Bettis. Or Bettis and Staley? Why not have a dual threat at RB. I've been wondering why they haven't returned to that type of offense. A big quick footed bowling ball and a smaller but tree trunk solid scat back. Both capable of catching passes like a receiver.


Like I said, I'm all for it, just haven't seen it happen during the current administration while we had any quality in our RB group whatsoever.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 10:25 am 
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If Bell plays like last year, or worse....he's looking at a BIG dropoff from what the Steelers offered 2 years ago.

I really hope PIT isn't still offering $12M+ per year.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 10:57 am 
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Scunge wrote:
StillerInCT wrote:
Is Bell missing OTAs and training camp such a bad thing?



I think it could be great for Jaylin Samuels. The competition behind Bell is very, very underwhelming. That #2 job could become Samuels if he really is as smart and as good as advertised. And Bell is going to wait until the very last minute to sign that franchise tender, last year wasn't it September 1st that he signed it? So, Samuels could be getting a lot of reps during training camp, during the preseason games, etc.

It is ironic really, if Samuels does end up having the rookie year that I think he can, 40 catches, maybe 1,000 all purpose yards (300 rushing, 400 receiving, 300 kick returns), 7 TDs, it may just mean that Bell does not have the gaudy numbers that he was hoping to get heading into free agency. Samuels has a chance to stealthly come in and steal playing time and production from Bell, and all because Bell will wait until September to sign his tender.


You're forgetting the most important part. Tomlin doesn't play back-up RBs more than a handful of snaps a game. Doesn't matter if Fitzy or DWill is the backup. If Bell his healthy, he touches the ball 30 times.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 12:45 pm 
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R S, I am not assuming anything with Tomlin anymore.

He, like Colbert have to see the writing on the wall, with Ben in the twilight of his career, with Bell in all likelihood his final season as a Steeler. They just traded Bryant to the Raiders.

Many here on this board are so desperate to have the Steelers squeeze out another Super Bowl with Ben that they are losing sight of what Tomlin/Colbert are doing. What are they doing?

They are building the next core, the next edition of the Pittsburgh Steelers. One that does not include Bell, or Ben, or Marcus Gilbert, etc.

2nd rounder on JuJu, 3rd rounder on James Conner, 4th rounder on Dobbs, trading for Vance McDonald. 2nd rounder on James Washington, 3rd rounder on Rudolph, 3rd rounder on Chuks, 5th rounder on Samuels. That is 2 WRs, 2 QBs, 2 RBs, a TE and a T.

What might they do in 2019 for the draft and free agency on offense? There is a changing of the guard happening on offense, the Steelers each year are adding more pieces, preparing for the eventual turnover that is impending.

Bettis gave way to Parker who was then replaced by Mendenhall and then Bell. Where once we had Ward, Holmes and Washington, that gave way to Wallace, Brown and Sanders, and now it currently is Brown, JuJu and Washington.

I think the status quo is not an option, too many new faces, too much quality talent. Things are going to change and I think for the better. So many want to just admit defeat, think that the Steelers will just fall apart when Bell leaves, if Ben retires, etc. Tomlin/Colbert have different ideas about that, they are drafting/building the next Steelers offense.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 6:58 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
R S, I am not assuming anything with Tomlin anymore.

He, like Colbert have to see the writing on the wall, with Ben in the twilight of his career, with Bell in all likelihood his final season as a Steeler. They just traded Bryant to the Raiders.

Many here on this board are so desperate to have the Steelers squeeze out another Super Bowl with Ben that they are losing sight of what Tomlin/Colbert are doing. What are they doing?

They are building the next core, the next edition of the Pittsburgh Steelers. One that does not include Bell, or Ben, or Marcus Gilbert, etc.

2nd rounder on JuJu, 3rd rounder on James Conner, 4th rounder on Dobbs, trading for Vance McDonald. 2nd rounder on James Washington, 3rd rounder on Rudolph, 3rd rounder on Chuks, 5th rounder on Samuels. That is 2 WRs, 2 QBs, 2 RBs, a TE and a T.

What might they do in 2019 for the draft and free agency on offense? There is a changing of the guard happening on offense, the Steelers each year are adding more pieces, preparing for the eventual turnover that is impending.

Bettis gave way to Parker who was then replaced by Mendenhall and then Bell. Where once we had Ward, Holmes and Washington, that gave way to Wallace, Brown and Sanders, and now it currently is Brown, JuJu and Washington.

I think the status quo is not an option, too many new faces, too much quality talent. Things are going to change and I think for the better. So many want to just admit defeat, think that the Steelers will just fall apart when Bell leaves, if Ben retires, etc. Tomlin/Colbert have different ideas about that, they are drafting/building the next Steelers offense.

The fans believe we will have no shot of winning a super bowl once Ben is gone. The Steelers themselves do not believe that.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 7:57 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
R S, I am not assuming anything with Tomlin anymore.

He, like Colbert have to see the writing on the wall, with Ben in the twilight of his career, with Bell in all likelihood his final season as a Steeler. They just traded Bryant to the Raiders.

Many here on this board are so desperate to have the Steelers squeeze out another Super Bowl with Ben that they are losing sight of what Tomlin/Colbert are doing. What are they doing?

They are building the next core, the next edition of the Pittsburgh Steelers. One that does not include Bell, or Ben, or Marcus Gilbert, etc.

2nd rounder on JuJu, 3rd rounder on James Conner, 4th rounder on Dobbs, trading for Vance McDonald. 2nd rounder on James Washington, 3rd rounder on Rudolph, 3rd rounder on Chuks, 5th rounder on Samuels. That is 2 WRs, 2 QBs, 2 RBs, a TE and a T.

I agree they are reloading with young guys, but I disagree that this group is done. Ben is five years younger than Tom Brady. Bell, with all his attitude, is far from done st 26 years old, although this might be his last year in Pittsburgh. Juju isn’t a project, he helps right now as do many of the young guys. The Steelers were a contender last season and we will be a contender this season. That’s not desperation or homerism, that’s what all the analysts agree upon.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 8:20 pm 
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I have a sneaking suspicion we won’t be having this conversation next year...as Bell will be gone.
JMO


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2018 9:53 pm 
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Scunge wrote:
StillerInCT wrote:
Is Bell missing OTAs and training camp such a bad thing?



I think it could be great for Jaylin Samuels. The competition behind Bell is very, very underwhelming. That #2 job could become Samuels if he really is as smart and as good as advertised. And Bell is going to wait until the very last minute to sign that franchise tender, last year wasn't it September 1st that he signed it? So, Samuels could be getting a lot of reps during training camp, during the preseason games, etc.

It is ironic really, if Samuels does end up having the rookie year that I think he can, 40 catches, maybe 1,000 all purpose yards (300 rushing, 400 receiving, 300 kick returns), 7 TDs, it may just mean that Bell does not have the gaudy numbers that he was hoping to get heading into free agency. Samuels has a chance to stealthly come in and steal playing time and production from Bell, and all because Bell will wait until September to sign his tender.


Quote:
Steelers rookie Jaylen Samuels taking advantage of reps without Le’Veon Bell at OTAs http://www.timesonline.com/sports/20180 ... sfeed=true
Just as you asserted Scunge.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2018 8:31 pm 
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"Reloading" is not the word that comes to mind with a group,above that includes Dobbs, Conner, Rudolph and chuks

Many young defenders regressed badly last year

We shall see

no faith at all that this HC will win football games with his own players


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2018 10:50 am 
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Poltargyst wrote:
Scunge wrote:
R S, I am not assuming anything with Tomlin anymore.

He, like Colbert have to see the writing on the wall, with Ben in the twilight of his career, with Bell in all likelihood his final season as a Steeler. They just traded Bryant to the Raiders.

Many here on this board are so desperate to have the Steelers squeeze out another Super Bowl with Ben that they are losing sight of what Tomlin/Colbert are doing. What are they doing?

They are building the next core, the next edition of the Pittsburgh Steelers. One that does not include Bell, or Ben, or Marcus Gilbert, etc.

2nd rounder on JuJu, 3rd rounder on James Conner, 4th rounder on Dobbs, trading for Vance McDonald. 2nd rounder on James Washington, 3rd rounder on Rudolph, 3rd rounder on Chuks, 5th rounder on Samuels. That is 2 WRs, 2 QBs, 2 RBs, a TE and a T.

What might they do in 2019 for the draft and free agency on offense? There is a changing of the guard happening on offense, the Steelers each year are adding more pieces, preparing for the eventual turnover that is impending.

Bettis gave way to Parker who was then replaced by Mendenhall and then Bell. Where once we had Ward, Holmes and Washington, that gave way to Wallace, Brown and Sanders, and now it currently is Brown, JuJu and Washington.

I think the status quo is not an option, too many new faces, too much quality talent. Things are going to change and I think for the better. So many want to just admit defeat, think that the Steelers will just fall apart when Bell leaves, if Ben retires, etc. Tomlin/Colbert have different ideas about that, they are drafting/building the next Steelers offense.


The fans believe we will have no shot of winning a super bowl once Ben is gone. The Steelers themselves do not believe that.


THIS fan believes we have no shot of winning a Super Bowl with Mike Tomlin as Head Coach.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2018 1:41 pm 
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I have had arguments, heated discussions of late on whether or not we have a shot of winning a Super Bowl EVEN with Ben. I of course did not believe that to be true but hearing the case made out to me it does have some merits. I will explain.

The argument that many of us have is that Ben is a franchise QB, has been to the Super Bowl 3 times, winning twice, and he can still play 3-5 more years. We all believe that you need that franchise QB to be able to win a Super Bowl.

And yet, there are valid points to be made that we have had Ben the past 9 years and he hasn't been anymore successful than Neil O'Donnell.

You look at O'Donnell's time with the Steelers, he lead the team to 7 playoff games, he went 3-4. He lost a Super Bowl, he lost an AFC Championship game. In that loss to San Diego, Neil passed for 349 yards, he was 32 of 54.

The stats he put up for his playoff run with the Steeler was this 158 of 273 for 1,690 yards, 9 TDs, 8 INTs and he was sacked 15 times.

I had a friend point this out to me before our Jax playoff loss. The point being that Ben was not really the difference maker that many make him out to be and from that Green Bay Super Bowl forward he has been more Neil O'Donnell than Big Ben.

So, the 8 games from that SB loss to right before the Jax game, Ben was 184 of 289 for 2,189 yards, 8 TDs, and 9 INTs and was sacked 19 times. Ben lost a Super Bowl in that time, he lost an AFC Championship game in that time. I must admit that is pretty eery, the similarities are quite striking.

But then Ben goes nuts, throws for 37 of 58 for 469 yards and 5 TDs in that Jax game, ironically enough surpassing some of O'Donnells playoff records. But just like O'Donnell he makes critical mistakes, He throws an INT that puts the Jaguars at our 18 yard line early in the first quarter. In the second quarter Ben fumbles, it is scooped up for a TD and we are again in a hole.

Yeah, wow, some could easily make the case that having Ben for the past 9 years is really no different than when we had Neil O'Donnell back in the day. But what is the kicker for me, and really makes me go hmmmm, is that Ben has a much better supporting cast than O'Donnell ever had.

And yet, these past 9 playoff games there really hasn't been much difference between him and O'Donnell in terms of wins or results or championships. It does make you pause, or it did me anyway, maybe, just maybe there is something to it, as much as I would hate to admit it.

Perhaps it might be for the best to not have Ben play until he is in his 40s, maybe we have gotten all we are going to get, there are no more championships to be had. But then you have a moment where you go, hey, Ben can have that storybook ending like Elway did and end his career with more Super Bowls!!! Yeah!! Me? I am torn between the two viewpoints, I can see both points, the case for each.

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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2018 5:53 pm 
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Rappln Lev is down to 15M from 17M. He'll still be rappin on the train out of town.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2018 5:53 pm 
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Rap'pln Lev is down to 15M from 17M. He'll still be rap'pin on the train out of town. Should have listened to Moma.


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 Post subject: Re: Bell Skipping OTA's
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2018 5:55 pm 
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Rappln Lev is down to 15M from 17M. He'll still be rappin on the train out of town.


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