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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 9:57 am 
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Ice wrote:
VeritasSteel wrote:
I know that people have got their nethers bunched over this kid but in watching those highlights (which are just highlights) I saw a player that can cover by himself and have enough ball skills to high point a ball as the underneath or trail technique guy. Something we do not have on this team from the safety position. From the looks of the tape- er highlights, he played every position back there and was an effective extra LB. His tackling makes him look more like an LB, not a safety. If I had a quibble on those interceptions he didn't have the breakaway speed to get away from a QB or WR running him down.

Admittedly, I wasn't in love with the pick and it feels like an arranged marriage. But these things last when the couple learns to love each other. But let's hope he is more Catherine Howard in deeds than Aggripina. Yeah, I love history and we should all have a woman like Catherine Howard whose only crime is she didn't have sons. Terrel Edmunds crime was he wasn't picked in the second round with someone giving us four 4ths, a seven, a block of cheese and a dowry animal- preferably a cow.


Love a good allusion or two, but the most important parts of the post are where you mentioned "admittedly just highlights." It's really difficult to find a whole game where there wasn't a brain fart or some sort of wart shown in the kid's game, when watching whole games. Now, the caveat there is that safety play is sometimes pretty hard to figure out, based on what they're really being tasked with doing in terms of movement on any given snap, but highlights are definitely highlights for a reason. I could produce some of Limas Sweed from UT that would get you really excited about him as a second round pick, and would leave you wondering how the heck he wasn't a multi-time Pro Bowler.


Seems like a great kid and probably smart but that is different from football instincts or football smarts. And you are right, lack of football instincts is not going to show up on highlights.

Last time our D was great, it was led by smart instinctual football players... Troy and Harrison.

Role player Ryan Clark was a very smart football player.

Since the Troy/Clark combination, we have had a run of athletic but dumb safeties.

The knock on Edmunds is he lacks instincts so it is a concern. Hopefully he helps us.


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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 10:04 am 
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Location: Sunny Delaware (but the murdery part)
The other thing to be hopeful about here is the coaching change. Carnell Lake became our secondary coach without much on his resume other than, well, being Carnell Lake. Tom Bradley has a pretty strong (and this comes from a Pitt alum and Buckeye fan, so basically as big a PSU hater as you'll find, ask Swiss) reputation as a teacher of the game, from everything I've seen of the players he's coached up, and been told by folks who should know far better than me. I don't love the pick, but I feel better about the possibilities this year than I would have last.


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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 10:23 am 
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Ice wrote:
Love a good allusion or two, but the most important parts of the post are where you mentioned "admittedly just highlights." It's really difficult to find a whole game where there wasn't a brain fart or some sort of wart shown in the kid's game, when watching whole games. Now, the caveat there is that safety play is sometimes pretty hard to figure out, based on what they're really being tasked with doing in terms of movement on any given snap, but highlights are definitely highlights for a reason. I could produce some of Limas Sweed from UT that would get you really excited about him as a second round pick, and would leave you wondering how the heck he wasn't a multi-time Pro Bowler.


I think Limas Sweed is a sports psychologist's wet dream. His talent was unmistakable. In college in practice- everywhere but the actual Pro football field. Every player is going to have warts and it's rare for a guy to come in from day one and give us Pro Bowl caliber play. But if they get this kid on the field and he starts making hits and shutting down those runs that our back end defense couldnt do- then all this is just chicken little fan talk can be swept under the rug in a year.

Havoc wrote:
Seems like a great kid and probably smart but that is different from football instincts or football smarts. And you are right, lack of football instincts is not going to show up on highlights.

Last time our D was great, it was led by smart instinctual football players... Troy and Harrison.

Role player Ryan Clark was a very smart football player.

Since the Troy/Clark combination, we have had a run of athletic but dumb safeties.

The knock on Edmunds is he lacks instincts so it is a concern. Hopefully he helps us.


I think there is a reason for that. The kid is smart and he was asked to use those smarts to play a variety of positions because of the talent around him at VT. I think you lose a lot of positional nuances when you're asked to do that. We asked Troy to play strong safety- not corner, not free safety, not slot- strong safety. In that, he could study and learn the tendencies of the opposing players and react to something instantly to where it looks like instinct. So much so that the smart teams started to use that against him later in his career to get him out of position. I think if they ask this kid to play A position in the defensive backfield and on occasion put him at the LOS to naturally make tackles- you will see that instinctual nature but in a traditional sense- Troy was on another planet. However, Troy missed a lot of tackles and put himself at injury risk with his type of play. I think this kid might not make as many of those splash plays- but we won't be cursing him out for missing a tackle that could have gotten us off the field on 3rd down.

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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 10:33 am 
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One thing to remember about Edmunds: coach's kid. He was the guy who knew what everybody was supped to do, where they were supposed to line up on every play. Last year he did all that playing multiple spots with a shoulder injury and a harness. The more I learn about him that I didn't know before the draft, the more I like the pick. As per usual.

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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 11:32 am 
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I'll hang my hat on that, athleticism and Bradley, B2B. Actually, added together, not terribly shabby.


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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 1:40 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
One thing to remember about Edmunds: coach's kid.


Also, Pro Bowl NFL Player son -- whose brothers also play in the NFL

I know bloodlines don't mean everything, but they are worth something.


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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 1:53 pm 
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Ice, I actually think watching highlights is a valuable tool as part of scouting a player. What is he capable of? Has he accumulated big plays?

If you trust your coaching, then seeing the best of what a player can do can be more valuable than picking apart the mistakes he makes. I think that's ESPECIALLY true of QBs, but it applies everywhere.

If there's one thing I hate in a prospect, it's a guy who has good technique, makes few mistakes, and doesn't make highlight plays. I guess you need some Larry Footes but I'd much rather give my coaches players who can make plays.

I understand that this is how you get an Artie Burns that you have to live with his mistakes as he learns/grows... but I'll take my chances with guys who have at least shown the upside worth drafting and getting in your building.

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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 2:51 pm 
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I definitely understand it's nice to know the guy is capable of big plays, otherwise you end up with, well, Marcus Allen. I just think it'd be helpful for casual draft fans to have a "lowlights" video to accompany the highlights. Otherwise, you probably look at the highlight reel, assume that the rest of the snaps are at least neutral, and end up unpleasantly surprised.


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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 5:26 pm 
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Ice wrote:
I definitely understand it's nice to know the guy is capable of big plays, otherwise you end up with, well, Marcus Allen. I just think it'd be helpful for casual draft fans to have a "lowlights" video to accompany the highlights. Otherwise, you probably look at the highlight reel, assume that the rest of the snaps are at least neutral, and end up unpleasantly surprised.

Yep, I think that's what I'm always looking for... why does he win when he makes a big play? Why did he fail when he makes a bad one? Is he a fit for what he was asked to do and would tasking him to do fewer or different things show his talents more?

Sometimes the "highlights" show me stuff that I interpret as bad things. For example, not once in Jeff Janis's highlights did he catch a 50/50 ball or one where he used his impressive vertical. Reminded me of what we didn't like about Mike Wallace.

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 Post subject: Re: Terrel Edmunds S Virginia Tech - 1st Round
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 5:42 pm 
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That's an interesting point about interpretation of the highlights, for sure. Just looking back at the Washington highlights packages again, they do show him to be a good fit for the things I'm thinking (based on who he's "replacing") he's going to be asked to do.

Based on a lot of the available camera angles on highlights and whole games safety play (even though I played it for 3 years in HS) has always been a tough one to get a read on, particularly when you think about all the things they're possibly asked to do on any given down.


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