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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:14 pm 
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Kodiak wrote:
Unfortunately, many of us have already anticipated Mitchell being cut and then brought back at a reduced salary.

Second, none of this matters. Unless Colbert hits the lottery two or three times, Mike Tomlin is in complete command of that defense. That's all you need to know to see that Tomlin has been a free rider on the talent of some players and coaches. His fingerprints are all over an awful defense - that's what Mike Tomlin brings to the table.


Well, that and WR bubble screens...

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:06 pm 
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Gonzo wrote:
Lynch wrote:
Wonder if Gay will take over?


Sweet Jesus I hope not


There was an article stating that maybe Cam Sutton would get a chance @ the FS spot. Apparently his football IQ is off the chain.


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:20 pm 
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Stillcajun wrote:
Gonzo wrote:
Lynch wrote:
Wonder if Gay will take over?


Sweet Jesus I hope not


There was an article stating that maybe Cam Sutton would get a chance @ the FS spot. Apparently his football IQ is off the chain.

We'd still need a SS in that scenario. Besides, Cam should be starting over Artie Burns.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:44 pm 
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Stillcajun wrote:
Gonzo wrote:
Lynch wrote:
Wonder if Gay will take over?


Sweet Jesus I hope not


There was an article stating that maybe Cam Sutton would get a chance @ the FS spot. Apparently his football IQ is off the chain.


Interesting.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:47 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
Besides, Cam should be starting over Artie Burns.


I agree, but Cam to FS might not be the worst route to go. You've got Haden and Hilton, so if Burns pulls his head out of his ass you really only need a SS (assuming Allen can be your dime guy stepping in for Gay). That has the potential to be at least an above average secondary.

I think that gives us a shot (with a hypothetical different coaching staff) with an R1 and R2 starter out of the draft at either OLB, ILB and SS.

I realize the Burns situation really isn't comparable to Ike. But Ike had his growing pains and then the light went on. Maybe Burns had lingering effects from a bad concussion, and with the cobwebs finally clearing maybe he won't worry so much about CTE.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:51 pm 
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How many big plays does anyone recall MM making in the last two years?

A big hit to stop a drive? Forced fumble? Interception?

All I saw, and granted I’m jaded, was him missing tackles, overrunning plays and NEVER making a big play.

I’m too lazy, but how many interceptions does he have as a Steeler?

Cannot wait to see some more speed and athletic ability at the position.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 4:29 pm 
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I remember actually seeing him pick one off, but seems like that was a couple years ago, I'm sure he's snagged a few. Seems like I can only recall one ff as well. What stands out most to me were the numerous 15 yd'ers that fucker committed. His first year or so here was brutal... for us.


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:38 pm 
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BarryFoster wrote:
How many big plays does anyone recall MM making in the last two years?

A big hit to stop a drive? Forced fumble? Interception?

All I saw, and granted I’m jaded, was him missing tackles, overrunning plays and NEVER making a big play.

I’m too lazy, but how many interceptions does he have as a Steeler?

Cannot wait to see some more speed and athletic ability at the position.

And I seriously doubt that you’ll see more interceptions. As much as guys like Mitchell should be upgraded, it still comes down to scheme, and what the Steelers ask and want their safeties to do. Tackle the catch didn’t leave town with Dick Lebeau...

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:47 pm 
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Talk also of moving Davis to FS


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:20 pm 
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Jobus Rum wrote:
BarryFoster wrote:
How many big plays does anyone recall MM making in the last two years?

A big hit to stop a drive? Forced fumble? Interception?

All I saw, and granted I’m jaded, was him missing tackles, overrunning plays and NEVER making a big play.

I’m too lazy, but how many interceptions does he have as a Steeler?

Cannot wait to see some more speed and athletic ability at the position.

And I seriously doubt that you’ll see more interceptions. As much as guys like Mitchell should be upgraded, it still comes down to scheme, and what the Steelers ask and want their safeties to do. Tackle the catch didn’t leave town with Dick Lebeau...


I saw many opportunities for picks on deep moon balls over the years. But yeah, get your point.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:23 pm 
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steelmann58 wrote:
Talk also of moving Davis to FS


People got on Sean Davis for allowing Gronk to tool him in the Pats’ game.

Mitchell was more to blame for that than Davis...he was never there to help on time.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:10 pm 
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BarryFoster wrote:
How many big plays does anyone recall MM making in the last two years?

A big hit to stop a drive? Forced fumble? Interception?

All I saw, and granted I’m jaded, was him missing tackles, overrunning plays and NEVER making a big play.

I’m too lazy, but how many interceptions does he have as a Steeler?

Cannot wait to see some more speed and athletic ability at the position.

4 INT's since 2015.

There's a few articles out there to catch up on a reason or 2 why Davis may get moved to FS. http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/stee ... 1802150130
Range is seen as a better fit at FS and Mitchell likely being a cap casualty I think they really have few options. It still amazes me that it takes just about a complete break down of player/talent before the issue is even looked at to resolve. Nothing this coaching staff does indicates to me 'preventative maintenance' regarding talent. Perhaps the talent evaluators have become complacent? Perhaps there is someone over riding the logic that needs applied? A Shame that so much sleeping at the wheel is allowed in such a prestigious franchise with a storied history of the opposite. JMO


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:46 pm 
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So these guys should be March 1 cuts?

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:57 pm 
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Could anyone give me examples of Sean Davis playing the single high safety last season.

The Steelers could have big time problems on the horizon

Artie Burns Sean Davis...Both look like they suck

I believe Tom Bradley can really coach and teach...We shall see

Neither has been reported cut yet...I wont be shocked if they cut Wilcox and re-work Mitchell's deal with a year or two added to the deal

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:33 pm 
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I don't know FC. I do remember Sean Davis having memorable plays down the field, deep down the field, not as an in the box typical strong safety, but more as that centerfielder making plays on the ball.

His rookie season Willie Gay was trying to cover Shephard, this was against the Giants, and Davis was back there deep and Manning threw the ball. Davis was able to just slide over and snatch the ball easily for the INT.

I remember a similar play against Baltimore this year where Hilton was covering a player who was running straight down the middle of the field and it was Sean Davis who was deep. Flacco let it rip and Davis read the whole thing all the way, slipped up and in front of the players and made the INT and then returned it for 41 yards.

Of his 4 INTs, he only returned two of them but one was for 41 yards and the other for 35 yards. When you look at his career, he just seems like a different player when he is further away from the line of scrimmage. As a FS, playing Mitchell's spot, he will have his eyes forward facing the QB, able to read and decipher plays faster. And he has proven to me that he has the hands and talent to make INTs. Isn't that what we want our FS to do? To be back there and be the last line of defense, come up and make hard hits, get your hands on INTs? Anybody remember the one KC game where Davis came up and separated the ball from Conley as he was making the catch? Sure, he was flagged on the play, but when does Mike Mitchell ever force contested catches like that? Honestly I remember more times where Mitchell came up and delivered a big hit on his own teammate.

Just have always thought that Davis was miscast as our SS and would be better as the FS.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:44 pm 
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I don't know if Davis is A great FS, but I think he's much better suited to that than he is to SS.

Both Davis and Burns are young... Burns, especially. There's hope that they'll get better. Burns, especially, I think has been all about the mental errors.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:30 am 
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I'm hoping that Bradley can reach both youngsters. Instill a work ethic and maturity that pays dividends. Better disciplined, football savvy, wrap up tackling.


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:18 pm 
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The simple fact is there is no such thing as a downgrade for Mike Mitchell - PIT might as well be playing 11 on 10.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:01 pm 
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The two things that have me really concerned with Artie Burns is that he plays soft against the run (tackling in general) and that he may be too stiff as a player. Those two things just don't go together. You can be a player who is not that fluid or agile and still be a great CB if you use your size and length and physicality to compensate for it.

When I try and watch him backpedal it is painful. It is like watching a RB run too upright through a tight hole, or watching an offensive linemen who refuses to bend his knees, who only bends from the waist. Burns is stiff, stiff, stiff.

But that is not a death sentence for a CB, if you have size, if you use your length and physicality to your advantage. He is a 6 footer, has arms over 33 inches long but he rarely uses those tools. Bradley really needs to work the hardest on Burns to try and turn his career around. I am hoping that Bradley and Joe Haden can get through to him and get him back on track.

In terms of Davis at FS and people worried about him being the last line of defense, I don't worry at all. He will be an upgrade over Mike Mitchell. Much easier to find a SS in this year's draft then a FS probably, moving Davis to FS allows you to tackle the first problem and who knows maybe Davis proves himself a solution to the FS problem.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:08 pm 
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Burns has his warts, but I think he had a fairly solid season and I'm excited about his future. *shrugs*

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:48 pm 
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I actually never understood why Davis wasn't at FS. He was a former CB and his body type is such that I think he'd make a fine FS (assuming he has the mental part of the game down).

I'm still high on Davis. I still recall some of the big breaks-ups he made over the last couple years in key situations. It's hard to assess him really with the garbage play we've gotten next to him from Mitchell over the last 2 years. Let's see what he can do if we are able to get a real safety next to him.


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:53 pm 
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Cam Sutton, and possibly even Willie Gay, could be in the mix at FS as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:22 pm 
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When I try and watch him backpedal it is painful. It is like watching a RB run too upright through a tight hole, or watching an offensive linemen who refuses to bend his knees, who only bends from the waist. Burns is stiff, stiff, stiff.

But that is not a death sentence for a CB, if you have size, if you use your length and physicality to your advantage. He is a 6 footer, has arms over 33 inches long but he rarely uses those tools. Bradley really needs to work the hardest on Burns to try and turn his career around. I am hoping that Bradley and Joe Haden can get through to him and get him back on track.


Ya, hopefully the new DB coach can get him in track.

Our HC, who was a former DB coach himself, must have been bogged down with other responsibilities to address any of this.

Or recognize it and spend the draft pic elsewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 11:07 pm 
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I think Gay would be an improvement over Mitchell next year. Hopefully they get lucky in the draft.


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 Post subject: Re: Mitchell and Wilcox expected to be released
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:13 am 
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Willie Gay is too stiff and long in the tooth to play FS. Doesn't have the COD needed IMO. Davis on the other hand has that COD and the length to make an ideal FS. I think the Steelers view Sutton as a boundary corner. I don't believe they'll move Sutton inside to safety. You are correct franco. Davis played both safety and corner in college. He mostly played corner. I think SS is the position the Steelers look to fill this draft. Moving Davis to his more natural position FS. I think that was the plan when they traded for Wilcox. They didn't count on Wilcox sucking out loud so bad. Trial and error I guess.


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