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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:34 pm 
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We won a super bowl with Kendall Simmons, Chris Kemoeatu, Justin Hartwig, Willie Colon, & freaking Darnell Stapleton. I think it's unlikely Mike Mitchell is a Super Bowl-quality S, but impossible to rule out.

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:53 am 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
We won a super bowl with Kendall Simmons, Chris Kemoeatu, Justin Hartwig, Willie Colon, & freaking Darnell Stapleton. I think it's unlikely Mike Mitchell is a Super Bowl-quality S, but impossible to rule out.


That really was a pathetic unit.

Nothing will convince me that Mitchell fits in anymore. He can play as a box safety somewhere else. He makes no plays on the ball, and he doesnt tackle well down the field. He is a one trick pony - guy can draw PI calls and generate bulletin board material. Time to move on.

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:38 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:38 am 
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Mitchell is a SS that can’t cover a TE or slot, so he can’t play in the box... but he also is late in zone coverage which makes him ineffective as a FS.

Davis is probably more FS, although he, too, struggles in zone, so he’s forced to play out of position at SS, where his lack of build makes him sucsceptible to getting run over and out positioned by TEs.

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:07 pm 
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All to true, B2B, funny how the times I have seen Davis playing deep and is able to read the QB and see routes develop, playing centerfield so to speak, he was able to make plays on the ball. This guy is supposed to be smart, speaks 3 languages, and I know he has the requisite speed and athletic ability, yet the Steelers are playing him out of position. He is not an in the box safety, not a beastly run stuffer. You put him back on the backend of the secondary and I think you have a much different and better player.

Also, it is amazing to me the player that Mike Mitchell was that last year in Carolina. They actually played him close to the line of scrimmage, used him a lot to blitz and get sacks.

This is what Mitchell did that year for Carolina, 72 tackles, 4 INTs, 2 FF, 10 passes defensed, and 4 sacks in just 14 games started. What the hell happened to that playmaker? I have always thought that the Steelers never really put Mitchell in the best position to be successful. Of course now injuries and time have taken their toll on Mitchell and he has fallen considerably as a player. Even so, something is wrong when you clearly have players like Davis and Mitchell miscast and playing out of position. Hopefully, maybe Bradley makes a difference and brings a fresh set of eyes and perspective and questions why these players have been miscast in their roles.

In terms of Jesse James and/or Bryant getting some sort of escalators/money based on performance or playing time? That is news to me. Both are going to have a hard time/rough sledding with Vance McDonald and JuJu getting more and more comfortable with Ben. James and Bryant are living on borrowed time, I can see both being off the team in 2019.

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:11 pm 
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MJB, I didn't endorse Mitchell staying on the roster. I foresee him remaining because that's Steeler way. Not because Mitchell deserves to stay. As far as Timmons goes. I think I read somewhere in here he's likely to play out what's left of his career in Miami. No way is he a tradeable player with the $8+ Mil he's penciled in to make this season. Miami won't cut him either as they'll still be on the hook for most of his salary. I don't see Timmons leaving Miami. The other names I listed are players that will likely be gone as well. The Steelers will not be first in line for anything FA related. They'll wait it out as usual and go slumming off the scrap heap. I agree with your premise of replacing Shazier and adding depth. That being such a tall order I'm not sure how they'll accomplish it. Speculating they'll draft a guy and likely bring in some tryout players. Perhaps they'll get extremely lucky one of the guys that are already on the roster will blow up the scene and earn his right onto the roster. Wait and see mode.


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:17 pm 
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If you play Mike Mitchell in the box, you'd better have a hell of a pass rush because Mitchell isn't covering anyone for very long. Using MM like a LB, it sort of works.

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:17 pm 
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What about Davis at FS - his more natural position, and taking a look at Su'a Cravens for SS. My guess is he could be had for a late round pick via Washington. IF he checks out health wise, which I believe was done by Pitt MD, then he might be worth a flyer. Word is he's probably done in DC. Hell, he might be able to play Shazier's role? Is it worth a late round shot, even though he might be a bit of a head case (no pun intended)?


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:21 pm 
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If you play like MM you'll have the whole fan base booing your ass and wanting you gone. Every opposing offense you face would be salivating all over themselves anticipating the long plays they know you'd take horrible angles to and then pathetically miss the tackle anyway.

I agree with the assessment that Davis is being played out of 'natural' position. I believe Davis was a corner in college as well as played some safety. Says FS to me all day long. Where Davis has played he really hasn't done terrible either. Some of that was coaching and some of it is God given talent. That said, I agree the Steelers have to lock up a SS/ILB hybrid type as has been discussed ad nauseam around these parts.


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:23 pm 
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DP39 wrote:
What about Davis at FS - his more natural position, and taking a look at Su'a Cravens for SS. My guess is he could be had for a late round pick via Washington. IF he checks out health wise, which I believe was done by Pitt MD, then he might be worth a flyer. Word is he's probably done in DC. Hell, he might be able to play Shazier's role? Is it worth a late round shot, even though he might be a bit of a head case (no pun intended)?

I agree with the Cravens idea. He applied for reinstatement yesterday I believe. What are the chances? Skins may be open to a trade: http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/red ... n-redskins


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:36 pm 
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Steelafan77 wrote:
DP39 wrote:
What about Davis at FS - his more natural position, and taking a look at Su'a Cravens for SS. My guess is he could be had for a late round pick via Washington. IF he checks out health wise, which I believe was done by Pitt MD, then he might be worth a flyer. Word is he's probably done in DC. Hell, he might be able to play Shazier's role? Is it worth a late round shot, even though he might be a bit of a head case (no pun intended)?

I agree with the Cravens idea. He applied for reinstatement yesterday I believe. What are the chances? Skins may be open to a trade: http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/red ... n-redskins

I would think between the Pitt MD handling him, Lynn Swann and JuJu we could probably get a pretty good read on the guy.


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:36 pm 
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I think who you want to be the starting SS and a S/LB hybrid are two different players, unless that S/LB hybrid is REALLY good in coverage going backwards... something it took Shazier 3 years to get good at.

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:52 pm 
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May not go over well, but I'd trade Bryant straight up for Cravens. There I said it.


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:50 pm 
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bradshaw2ben wrote:
I think who you want to be the starting SS and a S/LB hybrid are two different players, unless that S/LB hybrid is REALLY good in coverage going backwards... something it took Shazier 3 years to get good at.


Sure, that why I said some of our guys might have a good read on him.

I wouldn't mind them looking at Nigel Bradham (maybe $4-5m/per) for inside/outside LB either. He and Watt might be able to swap some, create different looks and still provide good coverage and pass rush.


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:11 am 
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Steelafan77 wrote:
I personally want nothing to do with Timmons. He has definitely lost his step(s) and as far as I'm concerned they pulled the plug at the right time releasing him. Not even for depth. I think they target a ILB as B2B states after the draft and likely roll with Mitchell one more season ending their contract obligations with him after the 18 season. Drafting a Safety in this years draft is I think priority. Secondary is the weakest link on this defense. Sparingly play your high draft pick Safety for a season while he's able to acclimate himself on ST's. Perhaps have him part of certain defensive schemes where he's not asked to think a lot and just react.

Some available ILB's currently...

Jonathon Bostic
Todd Davis
Preston Brown
Anthony Hictchens
Avery Williamson
Corey Nelson
Ben Heeney


I'm not so sure I wouldn't rather have a band-aid at ILB as a free agent. Lets be honest, we're not gonna replace Shazier, in the next two seasons, no matter what we do or who is available. I think I would rather have Derrick Johnson (Chiefs LB) as a band aid. 35 yrs old I know BUT; out with Deebo and in with Derrick. I think I would even take Derrick over losing something in a trade for Timmons.

I may be wrong but a 35 yr old LB SHOULDN'T command a high salary out of the Steelers cap range. Two yr contract and you have a band aid/insurance until this yrs 1st or 2nd round draft pick "becomes a man".

To me Derrick is kinda of a perfect fit at the moment. At the VERY LEAST, hes STILL a pretty BIG upgrade to our porous run defense. Plus, does he want to play for a SB or go to a team with cap abundance for the money?

Sign Derrick right now and then look to fix the hole at the safety position later but sometime before the draft. Can the Steelers swing Derrick Johnson (LB) to a decent salary and then go BIG, hard and strong at say Joyner (Safety)? I'm thinking, that would be sweet. Joyner the big FA signing they never make but really need this year AND Derrick Johnson, as a patch/band aid. BOTH huge roster holes/needs fixed, and before the draft!!!

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/22423126/kansas-city-chiefs-re-sign-long-star-derrick-johnson


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:09 pm 
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I think many of you are nuts for wanting Derrick Johnson over Timmons. No offense. Johnson is much OLDER than Lawrence Timmons. When we drafted Timmons he was a very young player, he just finished his 11th NFL season and is still 31 years old. Johnson? He is 35 years old.

Johnson has had a fine career but in KC they never really used him like we did with Timmons in coverage. We asked Timmons and before him James Farrior to run in coverage with fast athletic TEs and RBs and WRs and expected this great coverage. Johnson and any other big name ILB that you can name would probably look at videos of what our defense demanded of our ILBs in coverage and probably think to themselves that they were glad not to be in positions like that in coverage.

And yet Timmons and Farrior did the best they could and did as fine a job as one could expect. Timmons was also so damn durable.

I see Timmons having more in the tank than Johnson and see him being a perfect band aid for next season. He knows the team, the defense and you pair him with a rookie 1st or 2nd round ILB and that position is good to go for 2018. I do think Timmons will be cut by Miami and that we will pick him up and I think we may even still get a comp pick for him to boot.

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:43 pm 
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Nuts??? To want PFFs 5th ranked linebacker in coverage?
Nuts??? To want arguably the greatest team leader in Chiefs history for a team that has zero visible leaders.

Derrick Johnson can still play. He’d be an OUTSTANDING signing for a team with even a decent defense is playing in the Super Bowl. Hell no he’s not a long term solution that’s what the draft is for.

Lawrence Timmons on his best day wasn’t half as a good as DJ. Nothing nuts about wanting the better player and even past his prime it’s Johnson


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:11 pm 
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Don't get me wrong Scunge. Maybe I didn't word it right. Didn't mean to imply that I'd take Johnson over Timmons. I think it was 77 that laid out a good case why Timmons wouldn't get cut. That was a pretty big cap hit (dead money) he said Miami would have to eat. If the amounts are correct, I cant see them cutting Timmons loose.

I was looking at it more kill two birds one stone. I think Shazier injury leaves us with two HUGE needs at Safety and ILB. The Steelers NEVER even go BIG for one FA let alone two. However, the moves last year give me a sliver of hope. BUT, it was your breakdown of them shaving 45 million if they needed too, that gives me hope for at least one big money FA.

I thought with Johnson hitting the market it may be a way for the Steelers to fill both "needs" with only one "money" signing. I don't think Johnson would cost what Timmons or a younger free agent would and I don't want them to give up draft picks.

I'll actually be going to go to bed every night dreaming I'll wake up one morning to read the Steelers signed CB Trumain Johnson, Safety Joyner and a young up and coming stud ILB.

I'm really disappointed in Burns. Watching him run away from a tackle, way too MANY times this season, I lost hope. I don't think that can be fixed. If I'm right, that's three HUGE holes we have to fill.


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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:32 pm 
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SteelDrama wrote:
Nuts??? To want PFFs 5th ranked linebacker in coverage?
Nuts??? To want arguably the greatest team leader in Chiefs history for a team that has zero visible leaders.

Derrick Johnson can still play. He’d be an OUTSTANDING signing for a team with even a decent defense is playing in the Super Bowl. Hell no he’s not a long term solution that’s what the draft is for.

Lawrence Timmons on his best day wasn’t half as a good as DJ. Nothing nuts about wanting the better player and even past his prime it’s Johnson

couldn't have said it better

However, the Steelers haven't signed a defensive FA over the age of 30 since before Colbert

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 Post subject: Re: Dump Mike Mitchell for Tre Boston
PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:50 am 
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Steelersfan wrote:
Don't get me wrong Scunge. Maybe I didn't word it right. Didn't mean to imply that I'd take Johnson over Timmons. I think it was 77 that laid out a good case why Timmons wouldn't get cut. That was a pretty big cap hit (dead money) he said Miami would have to eat. If the amounts are correct, I cant see them cutting Timmons loose.

I was looking at it more kill two birds one stone. I think Shazier injury leaves us with two HUGE needs at Safety and ILB. The Steelers NEVER even go BIG for one FA let alone two. However, the moves last year give me a sliver of hope. BUT, it was your breakdown of them shaving 45 million if they needed too, that gives me hope for at least one big money FA.

I thought with Johnson hitting the market it may be a way for the Steelers to fill both "needs" with only one "money" signing. I don't think Johnson would cost what Timmons or a younger free agent would and I don't want them to give up draft picks.

I'll actually be going to go to bed every night dreaming I'll wake up one morning to read the Steelers signed CB Trumain Johnson, Safety Joyner and a young up and coming stud ILB.

I'm really disappointed in Burns. Watching him run away from a tackle, way too MANY times this season, I lost hope. I don't think that can be fixed. If I'm right, that's three HUGE holes we have to fill.


Miami takes no cap hit cutting Timmons. His guaranteed money was voided due to his suspension. He WILL be cut.

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