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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 8:53 am 
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scunge wrote:
See, that is the difference right there, "we have to wait and see if they can block first, if Rainey can blitz pickup." That is the old offense, the Arians way of justifying things.

Rainey and Paulson are never going to be very good or probably even adequate blockers, but they did show the ability to be very good options in space, in catching the ball and making big plays. The Steelers prior to the 2012 draft would never have drafted Rainey or Paulson with Arians' offense in mind. There is a fundamental change happening here and people need to get their heads around it.

Just by looking at the past 4 years with Haley, the past 2 with KC and before that his last 2 with Arizona, I noticed that he does get the RBs involved in the passing game.

Dexter McCluster had 46 catches in 2011.
Jaamal Charles had 45 catches in 2010.
Tim Hightower had 63 catches in 2009.
Hightower had 34 catches, Arrington had 29 in 2008.

With Arians you had Mendenhal's catches decrease from a high of 25 in 2009 to 23 in 2010 to 18 last season. Redman had 18 catches last season. That just isn't getting it done in today's NFL. It is rare to find a team that doesn't have at least one RB with at least 35 catches. Don't believe me? Let us go down the list from last season's RBs shall we?


Bal - Ray Rice 76
Ten - Chris Johnson 57
SD - Mike Tolbert 54
Hou - Arians Foster 53
Chi - Matt Forte 52
SD - Ryan Matthews 50
NO - Pierre Thomas 50
Was - Roy Helu 49
Phi - LeSean McCoy 48
Car - Jonathan Stewart 47
KC - Dexter McCluster 46
Mia - Reggie Bush 43
Jax - Jones-Drew 43
StL - Steven Jackson 42
NYJ - Tomlinson 42
TB - Lumpkin 41
Buf - Fred Jackson 39 (in just 10 games)
Buf - CJ Spiller 39
Oak - Michael Bush 37...

...then you get towards the bottom and you get:
Pit - Mendenhal 18
Pit - Redman 18

Some teams like SD had 2 RB go over 50 and Buffalo had two RBs with 39 catches. Every team, except for the Steelers, seems to have found a way to get their RBs involved in the passing game. That was totally on Arians. He had no plan and made no effort to really involve the RBs. It made defenses that much more capable of stopping us in the Red zone, stopping us from converting first downs, and keeping the points scored lower.

If a defense is able to just dismiss the RBs and the 2nd TE as viable threats in the passing game then so much the better and Arians made it so easy for them. I think Tomlin was getting sick of that and had to know that a change was needed.

Scunge.................dead on. Been saying that for years......and our lack of use of the RB's in the passing game got worse every year. I was looking at this last year...and I believe at one point more than half the teams had at least TWO backs on their team with more catches than any PS back. Same goes for the lack of involvement for the TE's. Makes the defense that much easier to defend..............and is one of the biggest reasons why Ben gets sacked so many times.....as he is focused on getting the ball to the WR's....while defenses drop more guys back into coverage due to little regard for a back coming out of the backfield or a 2nd TE in route.

I am optimistic about going into another year with the YMC crew........I am excited that they will get their first full camp and OTA's a s a group....Even if Wallace holds out....it should really be benificial to Brown and Sanders. These guys will be getting reps with Ben....as opposed to a 2nd team and 2nd and third string QB like their first year. And with Hines retired.....Cotch will also have the time to continue to develop with Ben.

Add Batch back into the mix and now Rainey.......................to bring our RB passing game into the 2000's...............hopefully by mid season we will be into 2010 form and by the playoffs we will be 2011/12 ready.

Continuing with the offense and hoping by mid season that we can work Saunders back in the mix.......................continuing to add flexibilty and depth to our offense. Do not discount Paulson on making the team. He is another guy that plays faster and smoother than his measurable. He will get down field faster than Heath.......makes that sideline out catch like a RB......very good hands.....and very good in traffic. Again.....lets wait and see what he does in camp.......but I am optimistic.

Now to top it all off...........all the above potential for our offense going into camp.....and we did not spend a pick on a skill player in the first 4 rounds.................

And....potentially our best OL in a decade?................yes potential, but when was the last time our line had (2) 1st's and (2) 2nd's as a possible early season line-up.

Anyway.........when does camp opening. Never went to camp....but thinking this may be my first.

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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 9:07 am 
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I'm still not going to get excited until I see it on the field.

New concepts can be exciting, but they have to be put into practice and made to work.

That's the bottom line.

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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 11:11 am 
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Sure, the draft has just finished but I am excited over what I perceive as some fundamental differences between Arians and Haley.

Would Arians ever have a player like Rainey involved in the offense? Or an H-Back like Paulson? I don't think so, that just has Haley's influence written all over those two picks.

Last season we had 13 players at the skill positions (WR, RB and TE) to start the season:

6 WR - Ward, Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotchery and Battle
3 TE - Miller, DJ Johnson and Saunders
4 RB - Mendenhal, Redman, Dwyer and Moore

This season coming up I see less position flexibility nonsense that favored a Johnson, and more tailor the offense to scheme players like a Rainey and Paulson to make an impact.

I see the 13 players as:

5 WR - Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotchery, and Clemons
4 RB - Redman, Dwyer, Batch and Rainey
1 FB - Will Johnson
1 H-B - David Paulson
2 TE - Miller and Saunders

Instead of having a DJ Johnson be a FB/TE/H-B and not really be any good at anything, it seems to me that the Steelers have learned their lesson and have brought on Will Johnson who can be a multi-dimensional FB and Paulson who can be an H-B while Wes Saunders has the talent to replace Miller in a year or two as the starting TE. Have the right tool for the job at hand.

Batch can and probably will see some time as a 3rd down back and Rainey will be a weapon in space and they will scheme him for big plays and mismatches both as a 3rd down back, and as a slot WR.

With Arians he was all about 3 WRs and 2 TEs yet he never really got his 2nd TE involved significantly in the passing game and Miller was often ignored at times or not as involved as he should have been. There was no Darren Sproles type of weapon out of the backfield and he wouldn't get Mendy involved fully into the passing game either. There were no H-Backs to speak of, DJ or Carey Davis masquerading as an H-Back is not getting it done.

With this first draft and off-season you can see things are not the status quo. Ben is going to have more weapons and more options than he has ever had before. In some cases, ever. When has Ben ever had a weapon like Rainey at RB? Or an H-back like Paulson?

I like what I am seeing from our new offense so far and our new offensive coordinator.


You forgot about Mendenhall. I love how everyone just assumes he's done. Can't wait to see what happens.

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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 11:23 am 
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Yoi !.......think scunge is talkin "to start the season"...............

I think Mendy does start on Pup..............and will give us a tremendous boost come mid season or before............

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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 1:07 pm 
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No, I didn't forget about Mendy and I should have specified that Pope will be Miller's backup for the first 4 games until Wes is back in my scenario.

Will Johnson is the guy that Tomlin/Colbert saw workout when they went to WVU to do their due diligence on players like Bruce Irvin and Keith Tandy. They quickly signed him when he did 30 reps of 225, ran a 4.49 at 6'2" 240 lbs and showed good hands and route running. His body type just seems to be that of a fullback, maybe an H-back. I just hope that he finally can give us a real, what I call a multi-dimensional FB like John L Williams. So, he is my dark horse pick to make the team as the FB. Perhaps that is short-lived when it comes time to activate Mendenhal. You have to think it will be one of the RBs that gets waived to make room for him. Either Will or Batch could be cut and then signed to the practice squad when it is time or Dwyer could be let go if he doesn't step up his game.

Again, what has me excited is that there seems to be a plan, a systematic assembling of talent. And there seems to be a plan to assemble talent in all shapes, sizes that complement each other.

Rainey gives us a Darren Sproles/Dave Megget type of player. Paulson is only 6'3" 245 and I don't think he really is going to get much bigger without sacrificing his speed and quickness. Forget the combine, at his Pro Day he ran in the 4.6s and he really has underrated athleticism. Will Johnson the FB prospect I talked about earlier. Toney Clemons is the tallest, biggest WR we have. 4 players that all offer different traits and will complement Wallace, Brown, Sanders, Cotch and Miller.

One of the problems that I had with Arians is that many of our players were too similar. Matt Spaeth was closer to Heath Miller in style than he was different. When we spent a 3rd rounder on Spaeth I expected somebody who was more athletic, somebody who could threaten the field vertically, somebody who would complement Miller but instead what we got was a bad clone of Miller.

It appears that rather quickly, Haley and the Steelers now have a very diverse group of RBs, TEs and WRs and as such the offense is going to have to change. Change because we now may finally have an OC who will design plays for the RB out of the backfield, for the TE, and for the H-B, not just as checkdowns but as viable plays. Having those positions suddenly be threats in the passing game will open things up even more for our WRs to make plays and vice versa. Great times ahead.


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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 2:56 pm 
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I'm excited about the new OC and the draft picks. Like the others, I will try to lower my expectations until week 1. If something strikes me as different during the preseason, then that's just gravy. I'm anxious to see improvements on both sides of the ball. Regular season can't get here fast enough.


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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 3:10 pm 
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How different/better the offense becomes ultimately falls on Ben. I think across the board most are assuming Haley > Arians. None of that matters if Ben doesn't evolve with the changes.

I've seen plenty of times where underneath routes are wide open yet Ben still takes a sack while looking downfield.

With his golf buddy gone hopefully those days are behind us.

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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 3:18 pm 
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I think one issue with Arians is he was too conservative. I know, fans say he upset the apple cart. But I saw just the opposite-- he did everything to not upset the image of apple cart. He forcibly created a "balanced offense" because that's what a bunch of critics (and maybe management) said he should do.

The second issue with Arians was out of his control, IMO. He had a miserable OL. I mean, you could have the biggest offensive mastermind ever and if Jon Scott is blocking backwards, the plan ain't happening.

Looks to me like Haley is going to have a very long leash. Tomlin is not one to micromanage anyway. Everyone around the org has respect for Haley, probably both from his father and his coaching career to this point, which has been really quite good.

So I think Hayle is just going to dream up some shit and put it in motion.

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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 3:36 pm 
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955876 wrote:
How different/better the offense becomes ultimately falls on Ben. I think across the board most are assuming Haley > Arians. None of that matters if Ben doesn't evolve with the changes.

I've seen plenty of times where underneath routes are wide open yet Ben still takes a sack while looking downfield.

With his golf buddy gone hopefully those days are behind us.


+1

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 Post Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 3:52 pm 
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We have high hopes but let's wait until a few weeks in to declare Haley > Arians.

BA did a good job getting us yards ("500 yards and a cloud of horseshit") but we couldn't score with the big boys. Let's face it, our redzone offense was feeble at best. No power running game (due to pussy OL + twinkletoes Mendenhall) combined with no WR over 6'0 combined with no creativity = 14 points a game.

I hope Haley above all = more points. We should be averaging at least 20+ a game.

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